From ehle at agni.phys.iit.edu Thu Feb 1 17:57:04 2007 From: ehle at agni.phys.iit.edu (David Ehle) Date: Thu Feb 1 17:57:10 2007 Subject: [LUNI] Re: luni Digest, Vol 48, Issue 1 In-Reply-To: <200702012300.l11N038q011787@null.sevatech.com> References: <200702012300.l11N038q011787@null.sevatech.com> Message-ID: Samir, I've run NIS, and I've run LDAP. How difficult the transition will be will depend on how deep you got into NIS for doing more than just simple auths. The package libnss-ldap should help make the transition mostly seamless. However I feel compelled to pass along the same advice given to me... If your doing a serious configuration for more than a small business you should probably be looking at kerberos with an LDAP back end instead. Its a much bigger pain to set up but will probably serve you better, and more securely in the long run. That said I've done installs of ldap auth twice now, once with openldap and once with fedora directory server so if you run into trouble feel free to drop me a message... though I'm far from a expert! Good luck, David. > Message: 1 > Date: Wed, 31 Jan 2007 17:59:31 -0600 > From: "Samir Faci" > Subject: [LUNI] NIS/Wordpress / LDAP > To: "Linux Users Of Northern Illinois - Technical Discussion" > > Message-ID: > > Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed > > I have an NIS network setup at work. *pause for the shivers and > screams to subside* > > So, my current dilemma is that I need wordpress to authenticate > against NIS. Has anyone ventured into those dangerous waters? Is it > feasible? > > Also, has anyone done an NIS to LDAP Migration? I've only attempted > to run LDAP once and I had issues with permissions and a few other > newbie issues. It still seems to be the better choice and the defacto > choice for Centralized authentication in Linux. > > -- > Regards > Samir Faci From knura at yahoo.com Fri Feb 2 18:11:57 2007 From: knura at yahoo.com (Arun K. Khan) Date: Fri Feb 2 06:42:16 2007 Subject: [LUNI] Lightscribe software for Linux ... Message-ID: <1170420117.5545.14.camel@genesis.intra.silverarc.biz> FWIW, Lightscribe labeler and writer from a couple of vendors http://www.lacie.com/products/product.htm?pid=10803 http://www.lightscribe.com/downloadSection/linux/index.aspx?id=815 -- arun khan From knura at yahoo.com Fri Feb 2 18:24:14 2007 From: knura at yahoo.com (Arun K. Khan) Date: Fri Feb 2 06:54:26 2007 Subject: [LUNI] Lightscribe software for Linux ... Message-ID: <1170420855.5545.27.camel@genesis.intra.silverarc.biz> FWIW, Lightscribe labeler and writer from a couple of vendors http://www.lacie.com/products/product.htm?pid=10803 http://www.lightscribe.com/downloadSection/linux/index.aspx?id=815 -- arun khan From knura at yahoo.com Fri Feb 2 19:16:47 2007 From: knura at yahoo.com (Arun K. Khan) Date: Fri Feb 2 07:46:59 2007 Subject: [LUNI] Vista v/s Linux matchup Message-ID: <1170424007.5545.48.camel@genesis.intra.silverarc.biz> The author installs both Vista and Mepis Linux on the same machine and does some "end user" comparison of the two. Interestingly, Mepis Linux comes out ahead on a few features. His system is about a year old (technology wise) and has 2GB of system RAM - nothing to sneeze at. Read more at (it is in three parts): http://desktoplinux.com/articles/AT9727687530.html and draw your own conclusions. -- Arun Khan From scott at guppylog.com Thu Feb 1 20:59:51 2007 From: scott at guppylog.com (Scott Lockwood) Date: Fri Feb 2 09:49:19 2007 Subject: [LUNI] OpenLDAP vs Fedora In-Reply-To: References: <200702012300.l11N038q011787@null.sevatech.com> Message-ID: <1170385191.9821.0.camel@scott-640m> On Thu, 2007-02-01 at 17:57 -0600, David Ehle wrote: > That said I've done installs of ldap auth twice now, once with openldap > and once with fedora directory server so if you run into trouble feel free > to drop me a message... though I'm far from a expert! > > Good luck, > > David I would really REALLY love to hear even an anecdotal comparison between the two. From kgarner at kgarner.com Fri Feb 2 10:06:53 2007 From: kgarner at kgarner.com (Keith T. Garner) Date: Fri Feb 2 10:06:59 2007 Subject: [LUNI] OpenLDAP vs Fedora In-Reply-To: <1170385191.9821.0.camel@scott-640m> References: <200702012300.l11N038q011787@null.sevatech.com> <1170385191.9821.0.camel@scott-640m> Message-ID: <45C3619D.80900@kgarner.com> Scott Lockwood wrote: > On Thu, 2007-02-01 at 17:57 -0600, David Ehle wrote: > >> That said I've done installs of ldap auth twice now, once with openldap >> and once with fedora directory server so if you run into trouble feel free >> to drop me a message... though I'm far from a expert! >> >> Good luck, >> >> David > > > > I would really REALLY love to hear even an anecdotal comparison between > the two. > I'll have something to report in the next few weeks. I'm doing it on a small cluster of machines at work. I can tell you one thing, Netscape/Fedora/Redhat/Whoever Directory Server is a lot easier to admin in a lot of ways than OpenLDAP. I've used OpenLDAP for a long time, but it just a pain in the pass on the admin side. One feature I like for Fedora is that the ACL's are stored inside the directory and updatable on the fly, unlike OpenLDAP. Keith -- Keith T. Garner kgarner@kgarner.com "Make no little plans; they have no magic to stir men's blood." - Daniel H. Burnham From sfaci at cs.uic.edu Fri Feb 2 10:36:29 2007 From: sfaci at cs.uic.edu (Samir Faci) Date: Fri Feb 2 10:36:41 2007 Subject: [LUNI] OpenLDAP vs Fedora In-Reply-To: <45C3619D.80900@kgarner.com> References: <200702012300.l11N038q011787@null.sevatech.com> <1170385191.9821.0.camel@scott-640m> <45C3619D.80900@kgarner.com> Message-ID: I presume that Redhat Directory Service is limited to RH. correct? Actually, I'd like to hear some feedback between the two. I did setup OpenLDAP before, but beyond providing user authentication, i've had some issues with deploying permissions for LDAP users. -- Samir On 2/2/07, Keith T. Garner wrote: > Scott Lockwood wrote: > > On Thu, 2007-02-01 at 17:57 -0600, David Ehle wrote: > > > >> That said I've done installs of ldap auth twice now, once with openldap > >> and once with fedora directory server so if you run into trouble feel free > >> to drop me a message... though I'm far from a expert! > >> > >> Good luck, > >> > >> David > > > > > > > > I would really REALLY love to hear even an anecdotal comparison between > > the two. > > > > I'll have something to report in the next few weeks. I'm doing it on a > small cluster of machines at work. I can tell you one thing, > Netscape/Fedora/Redhat/Whoever Directory Server is a lot easier to admin in > a lot of ways than OpenLDAP. I've used OpenLDAP for a long time, but it > just a pain in the pass on the admin side. > > One feature I like for Fedora is that the ACL's are stored inside the > directory and updatable on the fly, unlike OpenLDAP. > > Keith > > -- > Keith T. Garner kgarner@kgarner.com > "Make no little plans; they have no magic to > stir men's blood." - Daniel H. Burnham > -- > Linux Users Of Northern Illinois - Technical Discussion > http://luni.org/mailman/listinfo/luni > -- Regards Samir Faci safaci2000@gmail.com Quote: Although, golf was originally restricted to wealthy, overweight protestants, today it's open to anybody who owns hideous clothing. -- Dave Berry From kgarner at kgarner.com Fri Feb 2 10:47:44 2007 From: kgarner at kgarner.com (Keith T. Garner) Date: Fri Feb 2 10:47:49 2007 Subject: [LUNI] OpenLDAP vs Fedora In-Reply-To: References: <200702012300.l11N038q011787@null.sevatech.com> <1170385191.9821.0.camel@scott-640m> <45C3619D.80900@kgarner.com> Message-ID: <45C36B30.5040700@kgarner.com> Samir Faci wrote: > I presume that Redhat Directory Service is limited to RH. correct? No, you'd be wrong in that. From http://directory.fedora.redhat.com/wiki/FAQ#What_Operating_systems_are_supported.3F What Operating systems are supported? Fedora Directory Server supports: * Linux - Directory Server should build on: o Fedora Core 5 ( x86 and x86_64 ) o Fedora Core 4 ( x86 and x86_64 ) o Fedora Core 3 ( x86 and x86_64 ) o Red Hat Enterprise Linux 3.0 ( x86 ) o Red Hat Enterprise Linux 4.0 ( x86 and x86_64 ) o others - gentoo, ubuntu, more * Solaris 2.8, 2.9 (32 bit and 64 bit) ( sparc ) * HP/UX 11 ( pa-risc and ia64 ) It may work on other platforms as well. Past versions of the Directory Server have supported Irix, AIX, Windows, and OSF/1. See Building for more details. -- Keith T. Garner kgarner@kgarner.com "Make no little plans; they have no magic to stir men's blood." - Daniel H. Burnham From maney at two14.net Fri Feb 2 15:02:52 2007 From: maney at two14.net (Martin Maney) Date: Fri Feb 2 15:03:02 2007 Subject: [LUNI] Vista v/s Linux matchup In-Reply-To: <1170424007.5545.48.camel@genesis.intra.silverarc.biz> References: <1170424007.5545.48.camel@genesis.intra.silverarc.biz> Message-ID: <20070202210252.GA9393@furrr.two14.net> On Fri, Feb 02, 2007 at 07:16:47PM +0530, Arun K. Khan wrote: > The author installs both Vista and Mepis Linux on the same machine and > does some "end user" comparison of the two. Interestingly, Mepis Linux > comes out ahead on a few features. His system is about a year old > (technology wise) and has 2GB of system RAM - nothing to sneeze at. The one I like best so far, I think, is the guy (tech writer?) who's been running Vista since early betas. His bottom line after "hundreds of hours"? He's heartily *tired* of Vista. -- Viruses, Intruders, Spyware, Trojans and Adware - ah, MS innovation again From ccf3 at mindspring.com Fri Feb 2 15:07:11 2007 From: ccf3 at mindspring.com (Clyde Forrester) Date: Fri Feb 2 15:05:54 2007 Subject: [LUNI] Chicago 2600 ON THE 9TH ! Message-ID: <45C3A7FF.6040906@mindspring.com> Since I didn't see anything about a meeting on the second, I went looking. I guess it's next week and Maniac will get around to posting something. Show up today and I suppose you'll be met with dobermans and harsh glares. From mscott at pyewacket.org Fri Feb 2 14:42:50 2007 From: mscott at pyewacket.org (Mike Scott) Date: Fri Feb 2 15:42:53 2007 Subject: [LUNI] Ever heard of SimplyMEPIS Linux? Message-ID: <20070202144250.6095274834031e3691077dcdffae0724.740120943f.wbe@email.secureserver.net> Has anybody heard of this distro? http://www.mepis.org/ It is supposedly based on Ubuntu but with KDE instead of Gnome as the default. It is also supposed to have the ability to work with AD I saw it in an article comparing Linux to Vista (also a good read): http://desktoplinux.com/articles/AT9727687530.html - Mike Scott From ccf3 at mindspring.com Fri Feb 2 16:14:25 2007 From: ccf3 at mindspring.com (Clyde Forrester) Date: Fri Feb 2 16:13:01 2007 Subject: [LUNI] Ever heard of SimplyMEPIS Linux? References: <20070202144250.6095274834031e3691077dcdffae0724.740120943f.wbe@email.secureserver.net> Message-ID: <45C3B7C1.1080000@mindspring.com> Mike Scott wrote: >Has anybody heard of this distro? >http://www.mepis.org/ > >It is supposedly based on Ubuntu but with KDE instead of Gnome as the >default. >It is also supposed to have the ability to work with AD > >I saw it in an article comparing Linux to Vista (also a good read): >http://desktoplinux.com/articles/AT9727687530.html > >- Mike Scott > There is a Kubuntu distro which is like Ubuntu, only with KDE. I'm not sure how Mepis would want to differentiate itself from that. Clyde From nixternal at ubuntu.com Fri Feb 2 17:05:33 2007 From: nixternal at ubuntu.com (Rich Johnson) Date: Fri Feb 2 17:05:43 2007 Subject: [LUNI] Ever heard of SimplyMEPIS Linux? In-Reply-To: <45C3B7C1.1080000@mindspring.com> References: <20070202144250.6095274834031e3691077dcdffae0724.740120943f.wbe@email.secureserver.net> <45C3B7C1.1080000@mindspring.com> Message-ID: <200702021705.33392.nixternal@ubuntu.com> On Friday 02 February 2007, Clyde Forrester wrote: | Mike Scott wrote: | >Has anybody heard of this distro? | >http://www.mepis.org/ | > | >It is supposedly based on Ubuntu but with KDE instead of Gnome as the | >default. | >It is also supposed to have the ability to work with AD | > | >I saw it in an article comparing Linux to Vista (also a good read): | >http://desktoplinux.com/articles/AT9727687530.html | > | >- Mike Scott | | There is a Kubuntu distro which is like Ubuntu, only with KDE. | I'm not sure how Mepis would want to differentiate itself from that. | | Clyde Mike, Clyde is correct about the Kubuntu distro since I spend most of my dev time working with them. SimplyMepis is a Kubuntu derivative now and is a mighty fine Linux OS representing KDE quite nicely. I used it prior to Kubuntu, and probably would still be using it if it wasn't for the Ubuntu community structure which is great. -- Rich Johnson nixternal@ubuntu.com GPG Key: 0x2E2C0124 -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: not available Type: application/pgp-signature Size: 189 bytes Desc: not available Url : http://luni.org/pipermail/luni/attachments/20070202/bcbb5dda/attachment.bin From sean-lynch at sean-lynch.com Fri Feb 2 16:10:39 2007 From: sean-lynch at sean-lynch.com (sean-lynch@sean-lynch.com) Date: Fri Feb 2 17:08:46 2007 Subject: [LUNI] Ever heard of SimplyMEPIS Linux? In-Reply-To: <20070202144250.6095274834031e3691077dcdffae0724.740120943f.wbe@email.secureserver.net> References: <20070202144250.6095274834031e3691077dcdffae0724.740120943f.wbe@email.secureserver.net> Message-ID: On Fri, 02 Feb 2007 14:42:50 -0700 Mike Scott wrote: > Has anybody heard of this distro? > http://www.mepis.org/ > > It is supposedly based on Ubuntu but with KDE instead of >Gnome as the > default. > It is also supposed to have the ability to work with AD > > I saw it in an article comparing Linux to Vista (also a >good read): > http://desktoplinux.com/articles/AT9727687530.html > > - Mike Scott > > > -- > Linux Users Of Northern Illinois - Technical Discussion > http://luni.org/mailman/listinfo/luni Mepis predates Ubuntu by 4 or 5 years. It has always been a good debian based distro. Although, IMHO, not as nice as Libranet. Mepis was a small, mostly one man opertion, but Warren did a good job of putting things together. As the community grew, so did the Mepis team. For version 6, the Mepis team decided to base their distro on Ubuntu instead of vanilla debian. This lets them get a more stable release to base their upgrades on each year. Over all Mepis is one of the nicest commercial distros out there. For me Mepis makes Ubuntu almost useful, instead of frustrating. From r_a_smith3530 at sbcglobal.net Fri Feb 2 15:15:16 2007 From: r_a_smith3530 at sbcglobal.net (Robert Smith) Date: Fri Feb 2 17:22:02 2007 Subject: [LUNI] Ever heard of SimplyMEPIS Linux? In-Reply-To: <20070202144250.6095274834031e3691077dcdffae0724.740120943f.wbe@email.secureserver.net> Message-ID: <872698.23314.qm@web81307.mail.mud.yahoo.com> I never heard about it being based on Ubuntu, but it is definitely based on Debian. It is, like Ubuntu, a very "user friendly" distro. It can be run live, or installed to the hard drive. SimplyMEPIS includes a good selection of regular user, desktop add-ons. It does use the KDE desktop. Rob Smith Mike Scott wrote: Has anybody heard of this distro? http://www.mepis.org/ It is supposedly based on Ubuntu but with KDE instead of Gnome as the default. It is also supposed to have the ability to work with AD I saw it in an article comparing Linux to Vista (also a good read): http://desktoplinux.com/articles/AT9727687530.html - Mike Scott -- Linux Users Of Northern Illinois - Technical Discussion http://luni.org/mailman/listinfo/luni From sfaci at cs.uic.edu Fri Feb 2 17:27:38 2007 From: sfaci at cs.uic.edu (Samir Faci) Date: Fri Feb 2 17:27:44 2007 Subject: [LUNI] Ever heard of SimplyMEPIS Linux? In-Reply-To: References: <20070202144250.6095274834031e3691077dcdffae0724.740120943f.wbe@email.secureserver.net> Message-ID: Almost useful? I've had issues with Ubuntu's quirks driving me up the wall.. just curious as to what Mepis adds that makes it almost viable to use. -- Samir On 2/2/07, sean-lynch@sean-lynch.com wrote: > On Fri, 02 Feb 2007 14:42:50 -0700 > Mike Scott wrote: > > Has anybody heard of this distro? > > http://www.mepis.org/ > > > > It is supposedly based on Ubuntu but with KDE instead of > >Gnome as the > > default. > > It is also supposed to have the ability to work with AD > > > > I saw it in an article comparing Linux to Vista (also a > >good read): > > http://desktoplinux.com/articles/AT9727687530.html > > > > - Mike Scott > > > > > > -- > > Linux Users Of Northern Illinois - Technical Discussion > > http://luni.org/mailman/listinfo/luni > > > Mepis predates Ubuntu by 4 or 5 years. It has always been > a good debian based distro. Although, IMHO, not as nice as > Libranet. > > Mepis was a small, mostly one man opertion, but Warren did > a good job of putting things together. As the community > grew, so did the Mepis team. > > For version 6, the Mepis team decided to base their distro > on Ubuntu instead of vanilla debian. This lets them get a > more stable release to base their upgrades on each year. > > Over all Mepis is one of the nicest commercial distros out > there. > > For me Mepis makes Ubuntu almost useful, instead of > frustrating. > -- > Linux Users Of Northern Illinois - Technical Discussion > http://luni.org/mailman/listinfo/luni > -- Regards Samir Faci safaci2000@gmail.com Quote: Although, golf was originally restricted to wealthy, overweight protestants, today it's open to anybody who owns hideous clothing. -- Dave Berry From scott at cashnetusa.com Fri Feb 2 17:34:42 2007 From: scott at cashnetusa.com (Scott Lockwood) Date: Fri Feb 2 17:34:51 2007 Subject: [LUNI] Ever heard of SimplyMEPIS Linux? In-Reply-To: References: <20070202144250.6095274834031e3691077dcdffae0724.740120943f.wbe@email.secureserver.net> Message-ID: <1170459282.5700.56.camel@scott-640m> On Fri, 2007-02-02 at 16:10 -0700, sean-lynch@sean-lynch.com wrote: > For me Mepis makes Ubuntu almost useful, instead of > frustrating. Wow. I really have to boggle at that - what's frustrating about Ubuntu???? I've been an old slackware guy for more than 10 years, and I finally switched to Ubuntu. I can't imaging anything being frustrating about it. It just works. I'd turn my kids, or my mom loose on it even. From costi at rcn.com Fri Feb 2 17:45:42 2007 From: costi at rcn.com (Constantin Gavrilescu) Date: Fri Feb 2 17:45:58 2007 Subject: [LUNI] Ever heard of SimplyMEPIS Linux? In-Reply-To: References: <20070202144250.6095274834031e3691077dcdffae0724.740120943f.wbe@email.secureserver.net> Message-ID: <45C3CD26.4040101@rcn.com> Samir Faci wrote: > Almost useful? I've had issues with Ubuntu's quirks driving me up > the wall.. just curious as to what Mepis adds that makes it almost > viable to use. Linux is quirky. That's why we love it. From sfaci at cs.uic.edu Fri Feb 2 17:50:43 2007 From: sfaci at cs.uic.edu (Samir Faci) Date: Fri Feb 2 17:50:46 2007 Subject: [LUNI] Ever heard of SimplyMEPIS Linux? In-Reply-To: <1170459282.5700.56.camel@scott-640m> References: <20070202144250.6095274834031e3691077dcdffae0724.740120943f.wbe@email.secureserver.net> <1170459282.5700.56.camel@scott-640m> Message-ID: I honestly can't even put my finger on it.... but I really dislike Ubuntu.... and I'm not even sure why. I can't stand the whole sudo bit... or the no root. I know I can do sudo su then do a passwd and recreate root.. but half the gui apps are tied to the first user you create.. and ignores the /etc/passwd entry for root. Also, I managed to destroy Ubuntu by adding 3rd party repositories.. but then I've done that to every dsitro out there except for gentoo so far. *shrug* maybe i'll figure out what bugs me about it... well, my vp for uic lug is a big Ubuntu users so I just send all the Ubuntu users to him... -- Samir On 2/2/07, Scott Lockwood wrote: > On Fri, 2007-02-02 at 16:10 -0700, sean-lynch@sean-lynch.com wrote: > > For me Mepis makes Ubuntu almost useful, instead of > > frustrating. > > Wow. I really have to boggle at that - what's frustrating about > Ubuntu???? > > I've been an old slackware guy for more than 10 years, and I finally > switched to Ubuntu. I can't imaging anything being frustrating about it. > It just works. I'd turn my kids, or my mom loose on it even. > > -- > Linux Users Of Northern Illinois - Technical Discussion > http://luni.org/mailman/listinfo/luni > -- Regards Samir Faci safaci2000@gmail.com Quote: Although, golf was originally restricted to wealthy, overweight protestants, today it's open to anybody who owns hideous clothing. -- Dave Berry From dermusikman at yahoo.com Fri Feb 2 18:23:53 2007 From: dermusikman at yahoo.com (Jonathan Hadley) Date: Fri Feb 2 20:24:02 2007 Subject: [LUNI] Ever heard of SimplyMEPIS Linux? Message-ID: <833311.62766.qm@web32414.mail.mud.yahoo.com> I think Mepis was Kubuntu before Ubuntu started stratifying. I tried installing it on a friend's machine 2 or more years ago as an introduction to Linux (because i'm unfamiliar with GNOME), but was rather disappointed. It looks like they've adjusted their goals a bit, and may be a little better than my experience with it. Jon --------------------------------- Bored stiff? Loosen up... Download and play hundreds of games for free on Yahoo! Games. From zfhealy at sbcglobal.net Sat Feb 3 06:45:38 2007 From: zfhealy at sbcglobal.net (Francis Healy) Date: Sat Feb 3 08:45:56 2007 Subject: [LUNI] Ever heard of SimplyMEPIS Linux? In-Reply-To: <833311.62766.qm@web32414.mail.mud.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <6605.98201.qm@web83213.mail.mud.yahoo.com> Jonathan Hadley wrote: I think Mepis was Kubuntu before Ubuntu started stratifying. I tried installing it on a friend's machine 2 or more years ago as an introduction to Linux (because i'm unfamiliar with GNOME), but was rather disappointed. It looks like they've adjusted their goals a bit, and may be a little better than my experience with it. Jon I had used Mepis for a while before Sarge became stable (I believe this was before Ubuntu got started.) I really liked the K Desktop, the fact that it came as a live CD with a very easy installation, and the great hardware and video card detection compared to Debian Woody (it was as good or better than redhat 9 in many ways). The problem with Mepis was that since it was based on testing, there were numerous updates (bad on a slow connection) and some of the updates would play havoc with the system (one update of the xwindows system destroyed my desktop). When sarge became stable, I tried to change the apt settings of one of my mepis systems from 'testing' to 'sarge' and pretty much rendered the system unusable. Around this time there were some gaps in support and releases since Mepis was a very small operation at the time. I switched most of my systems to Sarge since my skills with Debian had improved and Sarge did most of the tasks I needed very well. I would recommend giving it a try. If its anywhere as good as the prior releases, you should hve some fun with it as I did. The past releases had most of the good features of Ubuntu without some of the annoying features that have been discussed on this list. fh From ohrock at gmail.com Sat Feb 3 09:09:47 2007 From: ohrock at gmail.com (Roberto Serrano) Date: Sat Feb 3 09:09:49 2007 Subject: [LUNI] Ever heard of SimplyMEPIS Linux? In-Reply-To: <6605.98201.qm@web83213.mail.mud.yahoo.com> References: <833311.62766.qm@web32414.mail.mud.yahoo.com> <6605.98201.qm@web83213.mail.mud.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <3d76512f0702030709j7dec0aa4t51b0a1cb4e0f3327@mail.gmail.com> I tried Mepis before they started using Kubuntu as their base, and it was pretty decent. Their community was really good at the time, but so was [k]ubuntus. Hardware support for me was not as complete as with Ubuntu and I personally dislike KDE, so I decided to use ubuntu instead, and I have been using it as my main Desktop OS ever since. I think what drives people nuts about Ubuntu is that keeps them bore. It doesn't take a week to get all the hardware support for a laptop running - like most times with gentoo. So in a way, ubuntu makes you dumb. As for me, call me lazy, but I don't like to deal with portage problems when upgrading gcc or X...or having to find/create a mysterious script to get the sound volume keys from my laptop working. Viva la Ubuntu! ( And similar distros, like Mepis) Roberto On 2/3/07, Francis Healy wrote: > > Jonathan Hadley wrote: > I think Mepis was Kubuntu before Ubuntu started stratifying. I tried > installing it on a friend's machine 2 or more years ago as an introduction > to Linux (because i'm unfamiliar with GNOME), but was rather disappointed. > It looks like they've adjusted their goals a bit, and may be a little better > than my experience with it. > > From sean-lynch at sean-lynch.com Sat Feb 3 08:54:50 2007 From: sean-lynch at sean-lynch.com (sean-lynch@sean-lynch.com) Date: Sat Feb 3 09:58:36 2007 Subject: [LUNI] Ever heard of SimplyMEPIS Linux? In-Reply-To: <1170459282.5700.56.camel@scott-640m> References: <20070202144250.6095274834031e3691077dcdffae0724.740120943f.wbe@email.secureserver.net> <1170459282.5700.56.camel@scott-640m> Message-ID: If your had been a debian guy instead of a slackware guy you would find Ubuntu frustrating. It's kind of like a crippled version of debian with lots of eye candy. I should clarify that I find Ubuntu frustrating because I have habits built using debian. Then I try Ubuntu and my habits don't match the way Ubuntu is set up. I can take the time to change Ubuntu to conform to my habits, but then solutons from the Ubuntu community may no longer work for me. It really has to do with my use of debian for the last few years. For instance, I've been using Zenwalk on my laptop for the last few months. Its a slackware derivative, but it is designed to be lightweight. It tries to pick one app for each function. It's kind of a slackware lite. It used to be called mini-slack. If you used Zenwalk, you would probably be frustrated because of your Slackware experience. You would probably enable the slackware package sources and upgrade the Zenwalk install to a slackware install, but then why not just use slack in the first place? I hope that helps you understand why I find Ubuntu frustrating. YMMV, Sean On Fri, 02 Feb 2007 17:34:42 -0600 Scott Lockwood wrote: > On Fri, 2007-02-02 at 16:10 -0700, >sean-lynch@sean-lynch.com wrote: >> For me Mepis makes Ubuntu almost useful, instead of >> frustrating. > > Wow. I really have to boggle at that - what's >frustrating about > Ubuntu???? > > I've been an old slackware guy for more than 10 years, >and I finally > switched to Ubuntu. I can't imaging anything being >frustrating about it. > It just works. I'd turn my kids, or my mom loose on it >even. > > -- > Linux Users Of Northern Illinois - Technical Discussion > http://luni.org/mailman/listinfo/luni From scott at cashnetusa.com Sat Feb 3 10:25:49 2007 From: scott at cashnetusa.com (Scott Lockwood) Date: Sat Feb 3 10:25:57 2007 Subject: [LUNI] Ever heard of SimplyMEPIS Linux? In-Reply-To: References: <20070202144250.6095274834031e3691077dcdffae0724.740120943f.wbe@email.secureserver.net> <1170459282.5700.56.camel@scott-640m> Message-ID: <1170519949.8946.4.camel@scott-640m> On Sat, 2007-02-03 at 08:54 -0700, sean-lynch@sean-lynch.com wrote: > If you used Zenwalk, you would probably be frustrated > because of your Slackware experience. You would probably > enable the slackware package sources and upgrade the > Zenwalk install to a slackware install, but then why not > just use slack in the first place? Because Mini-slack is gone, and that WAS my favorite way to do an install? :-D Zenwalk, huh? Got a URL? From ccf3 at mindspring.com Sat Feb 3 13:00:08 2007 From: ccf3 at mindspring.com (Clyde Forrester) Date: Sat Feb 3 12:58:42 2007 Subject: [LUNI] Ever heard of SimplyMEPIS Linux? References: <20070202144250.6095274834031e3691077dcdffae0724.740120943f.wbe@email.secureserver.net> <1170459282.5700.56.camel@scott-640m> <1170519949.8946.4.camel@scott-640m> Message-ID: <45C4DBB8.9050901@mindspring.com> Scott Lockwood wrote: >Zenwalk, huh? Got a URL? > http://www.zenwalk.org When in doubt, there's always http://distrowatch.com Zenwalk is currently number 13. Clyde From scott at cashnetusa.com Sat Feb 3 14:15:02 2007 From: scott at cashnetusa.com (Scott Lockwood) Date: Sat Feb 3 14:15:11 2007 Subject: [LUNI] Ever heard of SimplyMEPIS Linux? In-Reply-To: <45C4DBB8.9050901@mindspring.com> References: <20070202144250.6095274834031e3691077dcdffae0724.740120943f.wbe@email.secureserver.net> <45C4DBB8.9050901@mindspring.com> Message-ID: <1170533703.10577.0.camel@scott-640m> On Sat, 2007-02-03 at 13:00 -0600, Clyde Forrester wrote: > Scott Lockwood wrote: > > >Zenwalk, huh? Got a URL? > > > http://www.zenwalk.org > > When in doubt, there's always http://distrowatch.com > Zenwalk is currently number 13. > > Clyde > lol, true. THanks! From sushitech at voxlox.com Sat Feb 3 15:04:53 2007 From: sushitech at voxlox.com (D. Wade) Date: Sat Feb 3 15:05:06 2007 Subject: Debian Zenwalk (was Re: [LUNI] Ever heard of SimplyMEPIS Linux?) In-Reply-To: <1170533703.10577.0.camel@scott-640m> References: <20070202144250.6095274834031e3691077dcdffae0724.740120943f.wbe@email.secureserver.net> <45C4DBB8.9050901@mindspring.com> <1170533703.10577.0.camel@scott-640m> Message-ID: <45C4F8F5.8060605@voxlox.com> Clyde Forrester wrote: >> When in doubt, there's always http://distrowatch.com >> Zenwalk is currently number 13. I liked Zenwalk's "less is more" approach very much. No squillions of packages. Simple program launch bar. Fast. However, being more familiar w/ Debian than Slackware, I reluctantly let Zenwalk go and am back to Ubuntu. Are there any Debian-based distros which Zenwalk's out-of-the-box "1 tool for each job" approach? Until them seems my only alternative is Debian network install and add packages on my own one at a time. (ObMepis: I liked Mepis back when they were Sarge-based, and now they're Drake LTS I'll probably be giving them a try too.) From scott at guppylog.com Fri Feb 2 16:35:27 2007 From: scott at guppylog.com (Scott Lockwood) Date: Sat Feb 3 16:44:13 2007 Subject: [LUNI] Ever heard of SimplyMEPIS Linux? In-Reply-To: <45C3B7C1.1080000@mindspring.com> References: <20070202144250.6095274834031e3691077dcdffae0724.740120943f.wbe@email.secureserver.net> <45C3B7C1.1080000@mindspring.com> Message-ID: <1170455727.5700.53.camel@scott-640m> On Fri, 2007-02-02 at 16:14 -0600, Clyde Forrester wrote: > Mike Scott wrote: > >Has anybody heard of this distro? > >http://www.mepis.org/ > >It is supposedly based on Ubuntu but with KDE instead of Gnome as the > >default. > >It is also supposed to have the ability to work with AD > >I saw it in an article comparing Linux to Vista (also a good read): > >http://desktoplinux.com/articles/AT9727687530.html > > > >- Mike Scott > There is a Kubuntu distro which is like Ubuntu, only with KDE. > I'm not sure how Mepis would want to differentiate itself from that. > > Clyde > Yeah, the author, Stephen J. Vaughn-Nichols talks about that a bit - he claims only that he's never really cared for Kubuntu, and that he likes Mepis. I just downloaded it to take a look - So far, I'm unimpressed with the amount of begging they do on their website, but I'll reserve judgment until I get a chance to set it up. From vbubes at comcast.net Fri Feb 2 17:42:40 2007 From: vbubes at comcast.net (Vadim Bubes) Date: Sat Feb 3 16:44:14 2007 Subject: [LUNI] Location of ps2jpeg Message-ID: <45C3BE60.5010006@comcast.net> #!/bin/sh # # Convert a PostScript file to TIFF (24-bit RGB) using Ghostscript. # Then it is converted to TIFF (8-bit BW with LZW compression) with # the "tiff2bw" program. Resolution is 600 dpi. # case $# in 1) BASE=`basename $1 .ps` echo "Converting $BASE.ps to $BASE.jpg" gs -q -DNOPAUSE -r300x300 -sDEVICE=jpeg -sOutputFile=- $BASE.ps quit.ps \ > $BASE.jpg ;; *) echo "Usage: `basename $0` file[.ps]" 1>&2 ;; esac THE INFORMATION TRANSMITTED IN THIS ELECTRONIC COMMUNICATION IS INTENDED ONLY FOR THE PERSON OR ENTITY TO WHOM IT IS ADDRESSED AND MAY CONTAIN CONFIDENTIAL AND/OR PRIVILEGED MATERIAL. ANY REVIEW, RETRANSMISSION, DISSEMINATION OR OTHER USE OF OR TAKING OF ANY ACTION IN RELIANCE UPON, THIS INFORMATION BY PERSONS OR ENTITIES OTHER THAN THE INTENDED RECIPIENT IS PROHIBITED. IF YOU RECEIVED THIS INFORMATION IN ERROR, PLEASE CONTACT THE SENDER AND THE PRIVACY OFFICER, AND PROPERLY DISPOSE OF THIS INFORMATION. From stephen at theboulets.net Sat Feb 3 16:29:42 2007 From: stephen at theboulets.net (Stephen Boulet) Date: Sat Feb 3 16:44:15 2007 Subject: [LUNI] Help with bash script Message-ID: I'd like to write a script to backup my important linux files to my macintosh: rm -f tracks.sql mahler_backup.tar.bz2 mysqldump --add-drop-table -u root -p --opt tracks > tracks.sql tar -cpfj mahler_backup.tar.bz2 /usr/local/share/moin tracks.sql The middle step needs for me to enter the password, and this is where I get stuck ... Thanks. Stephen From david at midrange.com Sat Feb 3 17:27:43 2007 From: david at midrange.com (David Gibbs) Date: Sat Feb 3 17:28:40 2007 Subject: [LUNI] Re: Help with bash script In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: Stephen Boulet wrote: > rm -f tracks.sql mahler_backup.tar.bz2 > mysqldump --add-drop-table -u root -p --opt tracks > tracks.sql > tar -cpfj mahler_backup.tar.bz2 /usr/local/share/moin tracks.sql > > The middle step needs for me to enter the password, and this is where I > get stuck ... Have you tried putting the password in $HOME/.my.cnf? david From maney at two14.net Sat Feb 3 18:31:58 2007 From: maney at two14.net (Martin Maney) Date: Sat Feb 3 18:32:06 2007 Subject: [LUNI] Ever heard of SimplyMEPIS Linux? In-Reply-To: References: <20070202144250.6095274834031e3691077dcdffae0724.740120943f.wbe@email.secureserver.net> <1170459282.5700.56.camel@scott-640m> Message-ID: <20070204003158.GB9618@furrr.two14.net> On Sat, Feb 03, 2007 at 08:54:50AM -0700, sean-lynch@sean-lynch.com wrote: > If your had been a debian guy instead of a slackware guy > you would find Ubuntu frustrating. It's kind of like a > crippled version of debian with lots of eye candy. Well, I started out with Slack, but switched to Debian back around 1997. I don't have a clue what you mean by "crippled". There are obvious differences in the style of the two distros, and that's reflected even in the base install package sets ("server" install for Ubuntu) somewhat. As for the desktop, my impression is that Ubuntu doesn't have more eye candy as such, it's just more that's installed and working out of the box. For most desktop users, this is 100% a plus (and that's why I haven't had any desktops running Debian since... uhm, has it been a year and a half, now? I think it must be, since Dapper was an in-place upgrade on all the boxes here. How time flies!) > I should clarify that I find Ubuntu frustrating because I > have habits built using debian. Then I try Ubuntu and my > habits don't match the way Ubuntu is set up. I can take > the time to change Ubuntu to conform to my habits, but > then solutons from the Ubuntu community may no longer work > for me. I remember being annoyed about the sudo thing. I still notice it on occasion when I want to login to do remote maintenance on Cally's desktop machine, but it's nearly second nature. I have no idea what building a customized kernel is like under Ubuntu, since I no longer feel compelled to do so (maybe because the distro kernel is no longer a year or two old on average ). Everything else is either just the same (I still prefer aptitude to any other package management tool in all but corner cases; it still works just like on the servers running Sarge) or is different because I stopped resisting Gnome and all its petty annoyances (as well as its good features) when I switched the desktop boxes to Ubuntu. -- There's one way to find out if a man is honest: ask him; if he says yes, you know he's crooked. -- Twain From maney at two14.net Sat Feb 3 18:42:15 2007 From: maney at two14.net (Martin Maney) Date: Sat Feb 3 18:42:23 2007 Subject: [LUNI] Ever heard of SimplyMEPIS Linux? In-Reply-To: <833311.62766.qm@web32414.mail.mud.yahoo.com> References: <833311.62766.qm@web32414.mail.mud.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <20070204004215.GC9618@furrr.two14.net> On Fri, Feb 02, 2007 at 06:23:53PM -0800, Jonathan Hadley wrote: > > I think Mepis was Kubuntu before Ubuntu started stratifying. Nope. The guess that Mepis was out 4 or 5 years before Ubuntu was a bit off, but it *does* predate Warty's October 2004 release by about a year and a half. The transition to using Ubuntu as the base for Mepis was completed (for its first release on that base) in July, 2006. Thank you for nudging me to check the actual dates - I had been 99% percent sure Mepis wasn't all that old. -- One discharges fancy homunculi from one's scheme by organizing armies of idiots to do the work. -- Dennett From maney at two14.net Sat Feb 3 18:51:22 2007 From: maney at two14.net (Martin Maney) Date: Sat Feb 3 18:51:29 2007 Subject: [LUNI] Ever heard of SimplyMEPIS Linux? In-Reply-To: <3d76512f0702030709j7dec0aa4t51b0a1cb4e0f3327@mail.gmail.com> References: <833311.62766.qm@web32414.mail.mud.yahoo.com> <6605.98201.qm@web83213.mail.mud.yahoo.com> <3d76512f0702030709j7dec0aa4t51b0a1cb4e0f3327@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <20070204005122.GD9618@furrr.two14.net> On Sat, Feb 03, 2007 at 09:09:47AM -0600, Roberto Serrano wrote: > I think what drives people nuts about Ubuntu is that keeps them bore. It > doesn't take a week to get all the hardware support for a laptop running - > like most times with gentoo. So in a way, ubuntu makes you dumb. Bored? Well, maybe. I'm inclined to suggest that if playing with one machine isn't using up enough of their time, they should find some others to admin to absorb their free time. :-) It was partly the experience of doing upgrades on two (or three, counting the project-du-jour box) machines that pushed me to look for something less labor-intensive than Slackware. Dumb & happy - there's a lot to be said for it, as long as it doesn't blow up and hurt you. -- Graphic designers are not user interface designers. -- Philip Greenspun From chris at susi.net Sat Feb 3 19:39:57 2007 From: chris at susi.net (Christopher S. Susi) Date: Sat Feb 3 19:40:15 2007 Subject: [LUNI] Vista v/s Linux matchup In-Reply-To: <20070202210252.GA9393@furrr.two14.net> Message-ID: <07ac01c747fd$6392ede0$0100000a@black> "DesktopLinux.com columnist and operating system curmudgeon ..." Gosh, this is like wondering how the Reverend Jimmy Jonah of the Bleeding Mary Parish will conclude his sermon debating Evolution vs. The Good Lord & The Almighty Creation. He spends considerable time harping on BitLocker, which is moot in my opinion. As a windows user, I will use BitLocker as much as I use Windows Drive Double Space... never. I think this will end up being used far less frequently for the obvious reasons discussed already. I'd rather have a separate encrypted file that I can backup regularly to store my sensitive data than locking down the whole drive permanently. I can see IT departments making the same conclusion. Moving along... "While Linux often has trouble with WiFi, thanks again to proprietary drivers," ... haha I love how he needs to place the blame elsewhere. It's not because Linux doesn't have enough market share to make it economically worth while for the WiFi makers to make adequate drivers. My commodore 64 could be on the Internet if 3Com gave me working drivers. Anyhow... I'm waiting for him to try connecting to Windows shares from the perspective of a home user. We'll see which OS excels in that one. > -----Original Message----- > From: luni-bounces@luni.org [mailto:luni-bounces@luni.org] On Behalf Of > Martin Maney > Sent: Friday, February 02, 2007 3:03 PM > To: Linux Users Of Northern Illinois - Technical Discussion > Subject: Re: [LUNI] Vista v/s Linux matchup > > On Fri, Feb 02, 2007 at 07:16:47PM +0530, Arun K. Khan wrote: > > The author installs both Vista and Mepis Linux on the same machine and > > does some "end user" comparison of the two. Interestingly, Mepis Linux > > comes out ahead on a few features. His system is about a year old > > (technology wise) and has 2GB of system RAM - nothing to sneeze at. > > The one I like best so far, I think, is the guy (tech writer?) who's > been running Vista since early betas. His bottom line after "hundreds > of hours"? He's heartily *tired* of Vista. > > -- > Viruses, Intruders, Spyware, Trojans and Adware - ah, MS innovation again > -- > Linux Users Of Northern Illinois - Technical Discussion > http://luni.org/mailman/listinfo/luni From costi at rcn.com Sun Feb 4 00:40:54 2007 From: costi at rcn.com (Constantin Gavrilescu) Date: Sun Feb 4 00:41:01 2007 Subject: [LUNI] Help with bash script In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <45C57FF6.0@rcn.com> Stephen Boulet wrote: > I'd like to write a script to backup my important linux files to my > macintosh: > > rm -f tracks.sql mahler_backup.tar.bz2 > mysqldump --add-drop-table -u root -p --opt tracks > tracks.sql > tar -cpfj mahler_backup.tar.bz2 /usr/local/share/moin tracks.sql > > The middle step needs for me to enter the password, and this is where > I get stuck ... Change the middle row into: mysqldump --add-drop-table -u root -pyourpassword --opt tracks > tracks.sql Where you replace yourpassword with your password :) You may chmod 700 the script for some (false) sense of security. -- Nu ne fac ei pe noi! A+ Computer Services Corp. http://www.apluscompuservices.com From mlabowicz at gmail.com Sun Feb 4 08:54:01 2007 From: mlabowicz at gmail.com (Michael Labowicz) Date: Sun Feb 4 01:54:04 2007 Subject: [LUNI] Ever heard of SimplyMEPIS Linux? In-Reply-To: References: <20070202144250.6095274834031e3691077dcdffae0724.740120943f.wbe@email.secureserver.net> <1170459282.5700.56.camel@scott-640m> Message-ID: I love that description :) This is one of the major reasons I'm still using Debian instead of Ubuntu. On 2/3/07, sean-lynch@sean-lynch.com wrote: > > If your had been a debian guy instead of a slackware guy > you would find Ubuntu frustrating. It's kind of like a > crippled version of debian with lots of eye candy. > > -- > Michael Labowicz > http://www.labowicz.com/blog/ From sfaci at cs.uic.edu Sun Feb 4 10:56:24 2007 From: sfaci at cs.uic.edu (Samir Faci) Date: Sun Feb 4 10:56:37 2007 Subject: [LUNI] Help with bash script In-Reply-To: <45C57FF6.0@rcn.com> References: <45C57FF6.0@rcn.com> Message-ID: and if you do, make sure you chmod the hell out of that file so no one besides you can read it. putting passwords in plain text always makes me nervous. -- Samir On 2/4/07, Constantin Gavrilescu wrote: > Stephen Boulet wrote: > > I'd like to write a script to backup my important linux files to my > > macintosh: > > > > rm -f tracks.sql mahler_backup.tar.bz2 > > mysqldump --add-drop-table -u root -p --opt tracks > tracks.sql > > tar -cpfj mahler_backup.tar.bz2 /usr/local/share/moin tracks.sql > > > > The middle step needs for me to enter the password, and this is where > > I get stuck ... > > Change the middle row into: > > mysqldump --add-drop-table -u root -pyourpassword --opt tracks > > tracks.sql > > Where you replace yourpassword with your password :) You may chmod 700 > the script for some (false) sense of security. > > -- > Nu ne fac ei pe noi! > A+ Computer Services Corp. > http://www.apluscompuservices.com > -- > Linux Users Of Northern Illinois - Technical Discussion > http://luni.org/mailman/listinfo/luni > -- Regards Samir Faci safaci2000@gmail.com Quote: Although, golf was originally restricted to wealthy, overweight protestants, today it's open to anybody who owns hideous clothing. -- Dave Berry From sfaci at cs.uic.edu Sun Feb 4 10:58:26 2007 From: sfaci at cs.uic.edu (Samir Faci) Date: Sun Feb 4 10:58:30 2007 Subject: [LUNI] Ever heard of SimplyMEPIS Linux? In-Reply-To: References: <20070202144250.6095274834031e3691077dcdffae0724.740120943f.wbe@email.secureserver.net> <1170459282.5700.56.camel@scott-640m> Message-ID: Well... that's exactly what it is... it's a dumbed down version of Debian that requires little to no effort unless you try to think outside of the box. Once you try to do fancy stuff (especially server side) it gets annoyingly difficult to deal with. *shrug* -- Samir On 2/4/07, Michael Labowicz wrote: > I love that description :) This is one of the major reasons I'm still using > Debian instead of Ubuntu. > > On 2/3/07, sean-lynch@sean-lynch.com wrote: > > > > If your had been a debian guy instead of a slackware guy > > you would find Ubuntu frustrating. It's kind of like a > > crippled version of debian with lots of eye candy. > > > > -- > > Michael Labowicz > > http://www.labowicz.com/blog/ > -- > Linux Users Of Northern Illinois - Technical Discussion > http://luni.org/mailman/listinfo/luni > -- Regards Samir Faci safaci2000@gmail.com Quote: Although, golf was originally restricted to wealthy, overweight protestants, today it's open to anybody who owns hideous clothing. -- Dave Berry From eric at MacAdie.net Sun Feb 4 14:58:16 2007 From: eric at MacAdie.net (Eric MacAdie) Date: Sun Feb 4 14:58:30 2007 Subject: [LUNI] Help with bash script In-Reply-To: References: <45C57FF6.0@rcn.com> Message-ID: <45C648E8.8030103@MacAdie.net> What about entering the password as an argument to the script? Eric MacAdie Samir Faci wrote: > and if you do, make sure you chmod the hell out of that file so no one > besides you can read it. > > putting passwords in plain text always makes me nervous. > -- > Samir > > On 2/4/07, Constantin Gavrilescu wrote: >> Stephen Boulet wrote: >> > I'd like to write a script to backup my important linux files to my >> > macintosh: >> > >> > rm -f tracks.sql mahler_backup.tar.bz2 >> > mysqldump --add-drop-table -u root -p --opt tracks > tracks.sql >> > tar -cpfj mahler_backup.tar.bz2 /usr/local/share/moin tracks.sql >> > >> > The middle step needs for me to enter the password, and this is where >> > I get stuck ... >> >> Change the middle row into: >> >> mysqldump --add-drop-table -u root -pyourpassword --opt tracks > >> tracks.sql >> >> Where you replace yourpassword with your password :) You may chmod 700 >> the script for some (false) sense of security. >> >> -- >> Nu ne fac ei pe noi! >> A+ Computer Services Corp. >> http://www.apluscompuservices.com >> -- >> Linux Users Of Northern Illinois - Technical Discussion >> http://luni.org/mailman/listinfo/luni >> > > From costi at rcn.com Sun Feb 4 15:22:18 2007 From: costi at rcn.com (Constantin Gavrilescu) Date: Sun Feb 4 15:22:24 2007 Subject: [LUNI] Help with bash script In-Reply-To: <45C648E8.8030103@MacAdie.net> References: <45C57FF6.0@rcn.com> <45C648E8.8030103@MacAdie.net> Message-ID: <45C64E8A.1030904@rcn.com> Eric MacAdie wrote: > What about entering the password as an argument to the script? It will be shown by ps when you run the script and saved in your .bash_history. -- http://www.apluscompuservices.com From mswier at yahoo.com Sun Feb 4 15:39:32 2007 From: mswier at yahoo.com (Mike Swier) Date: Sun Feb 4 17:39:46 2007 Subject: [LUNI] ANN: NWCLUG's next meeting 2/6/07 Message-ID: <185051.20533.qm@web57007.mail.re3.yahoo.com> Hi, NWCLUG's next meeting will be at Harper College in A238 at 7pm on Tuesday 2/6/07. For (a bit) more info see http://nwclug.org/httpd/html/meetings.html#nextmtg mikie -- Linux Users Of Northern Illinois - Announcements Mailing List http://luni.org/mailman/listinfo/luni-announce From mswier at yahoo.com Sun Feb 4 18:00:49 2007 From: mswier at yahoo.com (Mike Swier) Date: Sun Feb 4 18:03:24 2007 Subject: [LUNI] ANN: [TechTalk] NWCLUG's next meeting 2/6/07 Message-ID: <000501c748b8$b19cbcd0$0d03a8c0@sbs2003test.local> Hi, NWCLUG's next meeting will be at Harper College in A238 at 7pm on Tuesday 2/6/07. For (a bit) more info see http://nwclug.org/httpd/html/meetings.html#nextmtg mikie _______________________________________________ Techtalk mailing list Techtalk@npotechs.org http://heinlein.bookwyrme.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/techtalk -- Linux Users Of Northern Illinois - Announcements Mailing List http://luni.org/mailman/listinfo/luni-announce From luni at pyewacket.org Sun Feb 4 18:00:17 2007 From: luni at pyewacket.org (Mike Scott) Date: Sun Feb 4 19:00:20 2007 Subject: [LUNI] Ever heard of SimplyMEPIS Linux? Message-ID: <20070204180017.6095274834031e3691077dcdffae0724.217271d970.wbe@email.secureserver.net> I was finally able to download the DVD iso, SimplyMEPIS-DVD_6.0-1_i386.iso. I tried twice from the ibibloo.org site and both times the MD5 CRC wouldn't verify. Finally I tried another mirror, carroll.aset.psu.edu, and this time it checked. Also downloaded in half the time (2 HRs vs 4 HRs). I sent their webmaster an email telling them about it. Hopefully someone will read it. I will burn a DVD and try it out this week sometime. - Mike Scott From maney at two14.net Sun Feb 4 19:24:54 2007 From: maney at two14.net (Martin Maney) Date: Sun Feb 4 19:25:02 2007 Subject: [LUNI] Help with bash script In-Reply-To: References: <45C57FF6.0@rcn.com> Message-ID: <20070205012454.GA10501@furrr.two14.net> On Sun, Feb 04, 2007 at 10:56:24AM -0600, Samir Faci wrote: > and if you do, make sure you chmod the hell out of that file so no one > besides you can read it. Yeah, that will help - when anyone who can run ps -aux on the box can read it from the command line displayed there. Oh, it does narrow the window somewhat, but.. > putting passwords in plain text always makes me nervous. Encryption can only make you as secure as the fellow looking over your shoulder as you type. I think Bruce said that, more or less. -- The most common implementation of SMTP is contained in sendmail. This program is included free in most UNIX software distributions, but you get less than you pay for. -- Cheswick, Bellovin & Rubin From maney at two14.net Sun Feb 4 19:31:00 2007 From: maney at two14.net (Martin Maney) Date: Sun Feb 4 19:31:08 2007 Subject: [LUNI] Help with bash script In-Reply-To: <45C648E8.8030103@MacAdie.net> References: <45C57FF6.0@rcn.com> <45C648E8.8030103@MacAdie.net> Message-ID: <20070205013100.GB10501@furrr.two14.net> On Sun, Feb 04, 2007 at 02:58:16PM -0600, Eric MacAdie wrote: > What about entering the password as an argument to the script? But then the script has to be run from a script which has the password in the clear... Or maybe you could use a trained monkey to type the password in. Then all you have to do is secure the monkey! -- We've all heard that a million monkeys banging on a million typewriters will eventually reproduce the entire works of Shakespeare. Now, thanks to the Internet, we know this is not true. -- Robert Wilensky From sean-lynch at sean-lynch.com Mon Feb 5 07:46:03 2007 From: sean-lynch at sean-lynch.com (sean-lynch@sean-lynch.com) Date: Mon Feb 5 12:44:24 2007 Subject: Debian Zenwalk (was Re: [LUNI] Ever heard of SimplyMEPIS Linux?) In-Reply-To: <45C4F8F5.8060605@voxlox.com> References: <20070202144250.6095274834031e3691077dcdffae0724.740120943f.wbe@email.secureserver.net> <45C4DBB8.9050901@mindspring.com> <1170533703.10577.0.camel@scott-640m> <45C4F8F5.8060605@voxlox.com> Message-ID: On Sat, 03 Feb 2007 15:04:53 -0600 "D. Wade" wrote: > Clyde Forrester wrote: >>> When in doubt, there's always http://distrowatch.com >>> Zenwalk is currently number 13. > > I liked Zenwalk's "less is more" approach very much. No >squillions of packages. Simple program launch bar. > Fast. However, being more familiar w/ Debian than >Slackware, I reluctantly let Zenwalk go and am back to >Ubuntu. > > Are there any Debian-based distros which Zenwalk's >out-of-the-box "1 tool for each job" approach? Until >them seems my only alternative is Debian network install >and add packages on my own one at a time. > > (ObMepis: I liked Mepis back when they were >Sarge-based, and now they're Drake LTS I'll probably be >giving them a try too.) > > -- > Linux Users Of Northern Illinois - Technical Discussion >http://luni.org/mailman/listinfo/luni Give Dreamlinux a look. Its a Brazillian distro, but their English support is pretty good. http://www.dreamlinux.com.br/english/index.html Its debian based with a XFCE desktop. The latest version has a lot of Multi-media programs added compared to previous versions. They have a live cd if you just want to try it out. Their using the Engage toolbar from enlightment instead of the XFCE tool bar. Engage seemed a little unstable, but it gives you that fancy mac-like expanding icon on mouseover. The rest of the distro seemed stable. From aclose at gmail.com Tue Feb 6 14:30:32 2007 From: aclose at gmail.com (Andrew Close) Date: Tue Feb 6 14:30:47 2007 Subject: [LUNI] [OT]: Looking for SCM consultants... Message-ID: sorry for the off-topic job posting. we just lost the consultant that was going to help us replace VSS and our (lack of) build process with an automated process and a real SCM tool. anyone out there have experience migrating companies source code to SVN and setting up 'Best Practices' for version control, continuous integration and automated building? our current environment is a horribly broken implementation of VSS and some poorly documented custom ANT scripts that compile and package deliverables, but there is currently no way to compile and package ALL deliverables in a single build. we have a combination of 137 JAR files with the occasional WAR and malformed EAR thrown in for good measure. this gig would be as much about setting up a good process based on best practices and open standards as it would be about installing/configuring the tools. the tools that we are leaning towards are SVN for version control, JIRA for change management, CruiseControl for continuous integration/scheduled builds, ANT as the base build platform (MAVEN would be too painful to move all of our code over to at this time). all of this will be running on RedHat (Enterprise?) Linux. if you have experience with projects such as this, and more importantly, interest, please pass your resume on to: Kyle Gams SPR/Redpoint Technologies Director of Business Development Office: 312.756.1760 ext. 213 Cell: 773-520-5150 kgams@sprinc.com http://www.redpointtech.com/ Kyle is acting as our HR resource for this position. if you have any specific questions feel free to contact me and i'll try to fill in the details. andy From brian at planetshwoop.com Wed Feb 7 06:07:06 2007 From: brian at planetshwoop.com (Brian Sobolak) Date: Wed Feb 7 06:26:49 2007 Subject: [LUNI] ANN: This Thursday is a UFO Thursday Message-ID: <20070207120706.GA4002@planetshwoop.com> This Thursday UFO-Chicago will be meeting at 4229 W Irving Park at 8pm to talk about al sorts of Linux, programming, and open source goodness. Please join us! Details at http://ufo.chicago.il.us/ brian -- Brian Sobolak brian @ planetshwoop.com http://www.planetshwoop.com/ "Bad taste is real taste, of course, and good taste is the residue of someone else's privilege..." -- David Hickey -- Linux Users Of Northern Illinois - Announcements Mailing List http://luni.org/mailman/listinfo/luni-announce From jquigley at jquigley.com Wed Feb 7 12:13:01 2007 From: jquigley at jquigley.com (John Quigley) Date: Wed Feb 7 12:13:04 2007 Subject: [LUNI] Chicago LUG meeting Message-ID: <45CA16AD.6020804@jquigley.com> Everyone: This is to notify you that the Chicago Linux and Lisp groups will be meeting this coming Saturday, February 10, 2007, at our standard location, The Chicago Institute of Design. Presentation topics for the Linux track: * The Io Programming Language (John Quigley) * AJAX Generation Using Perl (Michael Stemle) * An Introduction to LaTex (Tristan Sloughter) There is currently no set agenda for the Lisp group. If you are interested in helping bootstrap Chicago Lisp, please come! Further information can be found online: * http://www.chicagolug.org/ * http://www.chicagolisp.org/ We look forward to seeing you all there. Any questions or comments can be directed towards me. - John Quigley email: jquigley@jquigley.com phone: 312.351.3671 From SqrFolkDnc at comcast.net Wed Feb 7 13:25:54 2007 From: SqrFolkDnc at comcast.net (Carey Tyler Schug) Date: Wed Feb 7 13:31:34 2007 Subject: [LUNI] error message from apt-get #$ Message-ID: <45CA27C2.2020401@comcast.net> I installed the korn shell in my mainframe Linux, so I could migrate some shell scripts from other platforms (Solaris). The post-install tries to run add-shell, which is not present. Everything seems OK, I can invoke ksh, and the correct path is in /etc/shells. But every time I add another package, it tries to do that post-install again, and gives me the error message. I am a newbie. How do I clear this? Other than writing a dummy "add-shell" command that does nothing. Thanks in advance. From steven.mcgrath at chigeek.com Wed Feb 7 13:32:37 2007 From: steven.mcgrath at chigeek.com (Steven McGrath) Date: Wed Feb 7 13:32:55 2007 Subject: [LUNI] Fwd: OPPORTUNITY: SE Position at Sourcefire - Wanted to see if you knew of anyone that would be interested. Thanks In-Reply-To: <000f01c74aeb$be452140$6501a8c0@BIS.SOURCEFIRE.COM> References: <000f01c74aeb$be452140$6501a8c0@BIS.SOURCEFIRE.COM> Message-ID: <28326b7c0702071132o76787dbfi9368020e85dd1199@mail.gmail.com> Here ya guys go! ---------- Forwarded message ---------- From: Date: Feb 7, 2007 1:11 PM Subject: OPPORTUNITY: SE Position at Sourcefire - Wanted to see if you knew of anyone that would be interested. Thanks Would you know of anyone looking for a great position as a Security Pre-Sales Engineer at Sourcefire? If you do could you have them contact our internal recruiter Chris Kelly (contact information below) to discuss this position in more detail or have them call me directly at 847-809-0521? We are hiring immediately, this is an expansion position. This is a very exciting time at Sourcefire and we are anxious to find a great addition to our local team: Job Description: Security Pre-Sales Engineer Based in Chicago * Provide technical sales support for network intrusion detection appliances and intrusion management solutions. * Assist in driving sales process with the largest companies in the US. Required Skills * 3+ years experience in a technical pre-sales role * Must be proficient with Unix/Linux operating systems * Significant security experience, preferably with intrusion detection systems. * Snort experience is a plus. * Excellent working knowledge of TCP/IP and networking. * Strong communication (written and verbal) and interpersonal skills. * Experience in development of responses to RFPs and other technical writing a plus. * Travel required * College degree preferred. Sourcefire Positioned Solidly in the Leader Quadrant in Gartner Analyst Firm's Magic Quadrant Gartner Report: http://www.sourcefire.com/products/downloads/public/SF_gartner07.pdf?a=1&b=2#go From steven.mcgrath at chigeek.com Wed Feb 7 13:34:24 2007 From: steven.mcgrath at chigeek.com (Steven McGrath) Date: Wed Feb 7 13:34:40 2007 Subject: [LUNI] Feburary 9th Chicago 2600/DefCon312 Meeting Message-ID: <28326b7c0702071134r7a3f12f3wae855920e609a931@mail.gmail.com> NOTE: The Meeting is the Second week this month due to restrictions placed on the venue. The Feburary Chicago 2600 Meeting is near! The meeting will be Friday, Feb 9th at the Neighborhood Boys and Girls Club and will feature much of the same usual fun that all of you have grown to expect! [Special Meeting Information] Chicago TOOOL Meeting will also be going on in the same building. Omikron from TOOOL will be in attendance as well! http://www.toool.nl/index-eng.php [Presentation Information] - 8:00pm - The Future of Chicago TOOOL (Omikron) - 9.00pm - Chicago Con (DJ SubZero) - 10:00pm - How to build a public server (Maniac) [Tentative] - After hours - Wii, Music, Socializing, etc. [General Information] - Meeting Time: 7.00pm - Approx. 3-5am - Meeting Date: Friday, Feb. 9th - Place : 2501 W Irving Park Road, Chicago - More Info : http://chicago2600.net From chris.mcavoy at gmail.com Wed Feb 7 13:35:26 2007 From: chris.mcavoy at gmail.com (Chris McAvoy) Date: Wed Feb 7 13:35:35 2007 Subject: [LUNI] ChiPy Meeting Thursday February 7th 7pm Message-ID: <3096c19d0702071135q67c82c04ob02f486953b5dfc2@mail.gmail.com> Chicago Python User Group ========================= Come join us for our best meeting ever! Topic ------ * The Humanized (http://humanized.com) folks present their latest product "Enso", a Python based application recently profiled in the Wall Street Journal. Location -------- DePaul CTI 243 S Wabash Ave. Chicago, IL The computer lab on the 4th floor 7pm About ChiPy ----------- ChiPy is a group of Chicago Python Programmers, l33t, and n00bs. Meetings are held monthly at various locations around Chicago. Also, ChiPy is a proud sponsor of many Open Source and Educational efforts in Chicago. Stay tuned to the mailing list for more info. ChiPy website: ChiPy Mailing List: Python website: Pass it on. From SqrFolkDnc at comcast.net Wed Feb 7 13:52:44 2007 From: SqrFolkDnc at comcast.net (Carey Tyler Schug) Date: Wed Feb 7 13:52:53 2007 Subject: [LUNI] biography of Linus Torvalds and NWCLUG Message-ID: <45CA2E0C.3070204@comcast.net> There is a biography of Linus Torvalds, written by the author of the series of books for teen age girls about the sisterhood of the traveling pants. The books is oriented at younger people, but it still seems quite the opposite of her other work. The book is also slightly dated in some aspects, although it speaks of wine (the windows emulator) as if it was more evolved event than I feel it is today. Sorry, I meant to pass this around at the NWCLUG meeting last night, but forgot. From dmourati at cm.math.uiuc.edu Wed Feb 7 16:37:01 2007 From: dmourati at cm.math.uiuc.edu (Demetri Mouratis) Date: Wed Feb 7 16:37:08 2007 Subject: [LUNI] SSH Trickery Message-ID: Hi, While I'm normally the one proposing SSH tricks like the one I'm after, I thought I would throw this one out there for discussion. I have an office network, to which my, my boss's, and my entire engineering team's PCs are connected. This network sits behind a NAT firewall and is locally addressed in RFC 1918 space. We have a colo facility, with a number of Linux boxes and several networks laid out as VLANs. One network is for the production hosts, and there is a second network we refer to as an admin network. We run monitoring, logging, and other administrative processes from an ops2 server in this admin network against production, including SSH. We want to prevent our Eng team from accessing the production network while still allowing my group, Operations, to do their jobs. SSH access is allowed from the office network to the admin network, but only my boss and I have authentication via SSH keys. So, my question is this, is there some crafty way I can tell my client, openssh 4.3 to do a "double ssh" for hosts in the production network, first hopping through ops2, and then going to the production hosts in the protected network? I have ssh-agent forwarding enabled so this works if I do so manually, e.g.: [dmourati@demetri2 ~]$ ssh -l root ops2 Last login: Wed Feb 7 22:22:22 2007 from mynat.snvacaid.covad.net [root@ops2 ~]# ssh -l root threeprodds1 Last login: Wed Feb 7 22:18:49 2007 from ops2.lnc.rnmd.net Kickstart-installed on Fri Jan 26 00:55:20 GMT 2007 [root@threeprodds1 ~]# What I'd like is a setup that would let me get around this: [dmourati@demetri2 ~]$ ssh -l root threeprodds1 ssh: connect to host threeprodds1 port 22: No route to host Any tips greatly appreciated. Thanks. -D From ramin-list at badapple.net Wed Feb 7 14:46:31 2007 From: ramin-list at badapple.net (Ramin K) Date: Wed Feb 7 16:46:35 2007 Subject: [LUNI] SSH Trickery In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <45CA56C7.5010506@badapple.net> Demetri Mouratis wrote: > Hi, > > While I'm normally the one proposing SSH tricks like the one I'm after, > I thought I would throw this one out there for discussion. > > I have an office network, to which my, my boss's, and my entire > engineering team's PCs are connected. This network sits behind a NAT > firewall and is locally addressed in RFC 1918 space. We have a colo > facility, with a number of Linux boxes and several networks laid out as > VLANs. One network is for the production hosts, and there is a second > network we refer to as an admin network. We run monitoring, logging, > and other administrative processes from an ops2 server in this admin > network against production, including SSH. We want to prevent our Eng > team from accessing the production network while still allowing my > group, Operations, to do their jobs. ssh production_box useradd admin userdel engineer That's how we do it on my network. Am I making this too simple? Ramin From mlabowicz at gmail.com Wed Feb 7 16:54:40 2007 From: mlabowicz at gmail.com (Michael Labowicz) Date: Wed Feb 7 16:54:43 2007 Subject: [LUNI] biography of Linus Torvalds and NWCLUG In-Reply-To: <45CA2E0C.3070204@comcast.net> References: <45CA2E0C.3070204@comcast.net> Message-ID: What's the book called? On 2/7/07, Carey Tyler Schug wrote: > > There is a biography of Linus Torvalds, written by the author of the > series of books for teen age girls about the sisterhood of the traveling > pants. The books is oriented at younger people, but it still seems > quite the opposite of her other work. The book is also slightly dated > in some aspects, although it speaks of wine (the windows emulator) as if > it was more evolved event than I feel it is today. Sorry, I meant to > pass this around at the NWCLUG meeting last night, but forgot. > -- > Linux Users Of Northern Illinois - Technical Discussion > http://luni.org/mailman/listinfo/luni > -- Michael Labowicz http://www.labowicz.com/blog/ From dmourati at cm.math.uiuc.edu Wed Feb 7 16:54:54 2007 From: dmourati at cm.math.uiuc.edu (Demetri Mouratis) Date: Wed Feb 7 16:55:02 2007 Subject: [LUNI] SSH Trickery In-Reply-To: <45CA56C7.5010506@badapple.net> References: <45CA56C7.5010506@badapple.net> Message-ID: On Wed, 7 Feb 2007, Ramin K wrote: > Demetri Mouratis wrote: >> Hi, >> >> While I'm normally the one proposing SSH tricks like the one I'm after, I >> thought I would throw this one out there for discussion. >> >> I have an office network, to which my, my boss's, and my entire engineering >> team's PCs are connected. This network sits behind a NAT firewall and is >> locally addressed in RFC 1918 space. We have a colo facility, with a >> number of Linux boxes and several networks laid out as VLANs. One network >> is for the production hosts, and there is a second network we refer to as >> an admin network. We run monitoring, logging, and other administrative >> processes from an ops2 server in this admin network against production, >> including SSH. We want to prevent our Eng team from accessing the >> production network while still allowing my group, Operations, to do their >> jobs. > > ssh production_box > useradd admin > userdel engineer > > That's how we do it on my network. Am I making this too simple? > > Ramin Thanks Ramin, for the reply. I'm afraid that is a bit too simple as there are other ports/protocols in play here like the Oracle database, for which the same rules apply. I should have mentioned that as the reason we implemented the firewall rules in the first place. Back to SSH for a moment though. We have a "shared" account, called rhythm, named after the company, that we allow use for under extraordinary circumstances. We enable use of this account on a per-person basis by publishing the user's individual keys in the rhythm account authorized_keys file. This is how we deal with the inevitable requests by engineers to access the system via a shell prompt without giving up control. Password-based SSH access is disabled globally. We chose this approach versus a one-to-one mapping of accounts as it scales better and we have a large number of machines and growing. Thanks. -D From jlm at uic.edu Wed Feb 7 17:04:54 2007 From: jlm at uic.edu (John Mason) Date: Wed Feb 7 17:05:00 2007 Subject: [LUNI] SSH Trickery In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <20070207230454.GK14877@uic.edu> On Wed, Feb 07, 2007 at 04:37:01PM -0600, Demetri Mouratis wrote: > So, my question is this, is there some crafty way I can tell my client, > openssh 4.3 to do a "double ssh" for hosts in the production network, > first hopping through ops2, and then going to the production hosts in the > protected network? I have ssh-agent forwarding enabled so this works if I > do so manually, e.g.: > > [dmourati@demetri2 ~]$ ssh -l root ops2 > Last login: Wed Feb 7 22:22:22 2007 from mynat.snvacaid.covad.net > [root@ops2 ~]# ssh -l root threeprodds1 > Last login: Wed Feb 7 22:18:49 2007 from ops2.lnc.rnmd.net > Kickstart-installed on Fri Jan 26 00:55:20 GMT 2007 > [root@threeprodds1 ~]# > > What I'd like is a setup that would let me get around this: > > [dmourati@demetri2 ~]$ ssh -l root threeprodds1 > ssh: connect to host threeprodds1 port 22: No route to host ssh tunnelling. I do this everyday. ssh -N -q -f -L 30000:destinationhost:22 userid1@bastionhost ssh -p 30000 userid2@localhost where userid1 is my bastionhost userid and userid2 is my userid on the destination you'll want NoHostAuthenticationForLocalhost=yes in your ~/.ssh/config and you may want to define a host alias for your bastion. you can predefine your forwards in ~/.ssh/config too, like so: host priv hostname bastion user userid1 localforward 30000 destinationhost:22 host destination hostname localhost user userid2 port 30000 then you can pretty much just do ssh priv once and ssh destination to your hearti's content. -- %40 <- Ceci n'est pas une @. John Mason - jlm@uic.edu University of Illinois at Chicago - Academic Computing and Communcations Center Usenet Administrator, Listserv Administrator, Sun Software Contact et al. From ohrock at gmail.com Wed Feb 7 17:14:59 2007 From: ohrock at gmail.com (Roberto Serrano) Date: Wed Feb 7 17:15:03 2007 Subject: [LUNI] biography of Linus Torvalds and NWCLUG In-Reply-To: References: <45CA2E0C.3070204@comcast.net> Message-ID: <3d76512f0702071514o645d9eb4u60a7ccb1a545eed1@mail.gmail.com> Are you guys referring to Just for fun? http://www.thinkgeek.com/books/nonfiction/38b2/ On 2/7/07, Michael Labowicz wrote: > > What's the book called? > > On 2/7/07, Carey Tyler Schug wrote: > > > > There is a biography of Linus Torvalds, written by the author of the > > series of books for teen age girls about the sisterhood of the traveling > > pants. The books is oriented at younger people, but it still seems > > quite the opposite of her other work. The book is also slightly dated > > in some aspects, although it speaks of wine (the windows emulator) as if > > it was more evolved event than I feel it is today. Sorry, I meant to > > pass this around at the NWCLUG meeting last night, but forgot. > > -- > > Linux Users Of Northern Illinois - Technical Discussion > > http://luni.org/mailman/listinfo/luni > > > > > > -- > Michael Labowicz > http://www.labowicz.com/blog/ > -- > Linux Users Of Northern Illinois - Technical Discussion > http://luni.org/mailman/listinfo/luni > From ogradymp at yahoo.com Wed Feb 7 17:00:58 2007 From: ogradymp at yahoo.com (Michael P. O'Grady) Date: Wed Feb 7 19:01:07 2007 Subject: [LUNI] biography of Linus Torvalds and NWCLUG Message-ID: <201318.7329.qm@web52709.mail.yahoo.com> Hopefully I'm not crushing his dream, but I doubt that guy wrote "Sisterhood of the Traveling Pants" I think this is the book that was meant, its about 5 years old. Linus Torvalds, Software Rebel (Techies) (Library Binding) by Ann Brashares ----- Original Message ---- From: Roberto Serrano To: Linux Users Of Northern Illinois - Technical Discussion Sent: Wednesday, February 7, 2007 5:14:59 PM Subject: Re: [LUNI] biography of Linus Torvalds and NWCLUG Are you guys referring to Just for fun? http://www.thinkgeek.com/books/nonfiction/38b2/ On 2/7/07, Michael Labowicz wrote: > > What's the book called? > > On 2/7/07, Carey Tyler Schug wrote: > > > > There is a biography of Linus Torvalds, written by the author of the > > series of books for teen age girls about the sisterhood of the traveling > > pants. The books is oriented at younger people, but it still seems > > quite the opposite of her other work. The book is also slightly dated > > in some aspects, although it speaks of wine (the windows emulator) as if > > it was more evolved event than I feel it is today. Sorry, I meant to > > pass this around at the NWCLUG meeting last night, but forgot. > > -- > > Linux Users Of Northern Illinois - Technical Discussion > > http://luni.org/mailman/listinfo/luni > > > > > > -- > Michael Labowicz > http://www.labowicz.com/blog/ > -- > Linux Users Of Northern Illinois - Technical Discussion > http://luni.org/mailman/listinfo/luni > -- Linux Users Of Northern Illinois - Technical Discussion http://luni.org/mailman/listinfo/luni ____________________________________________________________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? Everyone is raving about the all-new Yahoo! Mail beta. http://new.mail.yahoo.com From SqrFolkDnc at comcast.net Wed Feb 7 22:02:15 2007 From: SqrFolkDnc at comcast.net (Carey Tyler Schug) Date: Wed Feb 7 22:02:21 2007 Subject: [LUNI] I finally got mainframe linux up #$ Message-ID: <45CAA0C7.4020802@comcast.net> I finally got the Hercules emulator working, and under it I have run Mainframe 31 bit Linux, along with the old "free" versions of MVS 3.8 and VM R6. Still working on some issues (like running MVS3.8 under VM R6, and installing 64 bit Linux), plus I would like to be able to use x3270 instead of c3270, I think. At least I haven't figured out how to initialize several c3270 sessions automatically as the system comes up, but x3270 sessions are suppose to be able to be made automatic. Is anybody else on this list using Hercules? Or the simh to simulate other classic computers? From wiggles at xnet.com Wed Feb 7 22:38:47 2007 From: wiggles at xnet.com (Tim Wielgos) Date: Wed Feb 7 22:38:36 2007 Subject: [LUNI] I finally got mainframe linux up #$ In-Reply-To: <45CAA0C7.4020802@comcast.net> References: <45CAA0C7.4020802@comcast.net> Message-ID: <45CAA957.6090705@xnet.com> You are seriously hard core. Seriously. I have no idea what else to say. Carey Tyler Schug wrote: > I finally got the Hercules emulator working, and under it I have run > Mainframe 31 bit Linux, along with the old "free" versions of MVS 3.8 > and VM R6. > > Still working on some issues (like running MVS3.8 under VM R6, and > installing 64 bit Linux), plus I would like to be able to use x3270 > instead of c3270, I think. At least I haven't figured out how to > initialize several c3270 sessions automatically as the system comes > up, but x3270 sessions are suppose to be able to be made automatic. > > Is anybody else on this list using Hercules? Or the simh to simulate > other classic computers? From ken at stox.org Wed Feb 7 22:53:42 2007 From: ken at stox.org (Kenneth P. Stox) Date: Wed Feb 7 22:53:59 2007 Subject: [LUNI] I finally got mainframe linux up #$ In-Reply-To: <45CAA0C7.4020802@comcast.net> References: <45CAA0C7.4020802@comcast.net> Message-ID: <1170910422.6077.13.camel@stox.dyndns.org> On Wed, 2007-02-07 at 22:02 -0600, Carey Tyler Schug wrote: > I finally got the Hercules emulator working, and under it I have run > Mainframe 31 bit Linux, along with the old "free" versions of MVS 3.8 > and VM R6. Masochism at its best! Just add punch cards, and you're all set. ;-> ABEND From sfaci at cs.uic.edu Wed Feb 7 23:29:13 2007 From: sfaci at cs.uic.edu (Samir Faci) Date: Wed Feb 7 23:29:15 2007 Subject: [LUNI] I finally got mainframe linux up #$ In-Reply-To: <1170910422.6077.13.camel@stox.dyndns.org> References: <45CAA0C7.4020802@comcast.net> <1170910422.6077.13.camel@stox.dyndns.org> Message-ID: You know.. I actually wouldn't mind seeing some howto on that.. or docs. and yes.. definitely masochist ...but so is running linux half the time... (or is that vista.. i forget) On 2/7/07, Kenneth P. Stox wrote: > On Wed, 2007-02-07 at 22:02 -0600, Carey Tyler Schug wrote: > > I finally got the Hercules emulator working, and under it I have run > > Mainframe 31 bit Linux, along with the old "free" versions of MVS 3.8 > > and VM R6. > > Masochism at its best! Just add punch cards, and you're all set. ;-> > > ABEND > > > > > -- > Linux Users Of Northern Illinois - Technical Discussion > http://luni.org/mailman/listinfo/luni > -- Regards Samir Faci safaci2000@gmail.com Quote: Although, golf was originally restricted to wealthy, overweight protestants, today it's open to anybody who owns hideous clothing. -- Dave Berry From lists at redboy.cx Thu Feb 8 09:33:00 2007 From: lists at redboy.cx (sten) Date: Thu Feb 8 09:55:23 2007 Subject: [LUNI] I finally got mainframe linux up #$ In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <81c818fca7c84074ac05316a1c910dca@localhost> On Wed, 7 Feb 2007 23:29:13 -0600, "Samir Faci" wrote: > You know.. I actually wouldn't mind seeing some howto on that.. or docs. > > and yes.. definitely masochist ...but so is running linux half the > time... (or is that vista.. i forget) > > On 2/7/07, Kenneth P. Stox wrote: >> On Wed, 2007-02-07 at 22:02 -0600, Carey Tyler Schug wrote: >> > I finally got the Hercules emulator working, and under it I have run >> > Mainframe 31 bit Linux, along with the old "free" versions of MVS 3.8 >> > and VM R6. >> I would, too, actually. We've got plenty of mainframe Linux here, and only one guy can really support it. It'd be nice to have a testbed where we can learn and break stuff. I'd never even heard of Hercules, looking into it now. Thanks! Sten From SqrFolkDnc at comcast.net Thu Feb 8 09:59:12 2007 From: SqrFolkDnc at comcast.net (Carey Tyler Schug) Date: Thu Feb 8 09:59:39 2007 Subject: [LUNI] I finally got mainframe linux up #$ In-Reply-To: <1170910422.6077.13.camel@stox.dyndns.org> References: <45CAA0C7.4020802@comcast.net> <1170910422.6077.13.camel@stox.dyndns.org> Message-ID: <45CB48D0.20105@comcast.net> Actually, I do have a device that could be rewired to read one card at a time, two passes per card. It was a card programmer from a Wang programmable calculator, it reads every other column of an 80 column card, so flip the card over and read the other columns. It had a big fat cable which was cut off, so it would have to be wired up to a matrix of parallel input ports. You had to have a bit of masochism to be a computer person in the early days..... Kenneth P. Stox wrote: > On Wed, 2007-02-07 at 22:02 -0600, Carey Tyler Schug wrote: > >> I finally got the Hercules emulator working, and under it I have run >> Mainframe 31 bit Linux, along with the old "free" versions of MVS 3.8 >> and VM R6. >> > > Masochism at its best! Just add punch cards, and you're all set. ;-> > > ABEND > > > > > From skie at dragonsvalley.com Thu Feb 8 10:37:45 2007 From: skie at dragonsvalley.com (Branko Kotur) Date: Thu Feb 8 10:37:55 2007 Subject: [LUNI] VHS to DVD conversion Message-ID: <200702081037.45866.skie@dragonsvalley.com> I'd recently found some old home movies that are on VHS and while watching them, I realized not only that the tapes won't last forever, but the quality seemed to be degraded from what I remember years ago. So, I've decided to find a way to convert them to DVD's, preferably using Linux (what else would I use?). I have all the software I need to create the DVD formats once the video is on my computer. What I don't have is a way to import the video to the computer from VHS. I'm assuming that I'll need some type of hardware that sits between the VCR and the computer (it'll need to use either coax or RCA cables, I think RCA is the easier way to go). My question is, does anyone know of what hardware I can use? I have USB 2.0 and Firewire, so that shouldn't be an issue. I think I've used all of my PCI slots, so I'd like to avoid that route, plus I'd like to use it on the laptop if I feel like it. Any suggestions? From SqrFolkDnc at comcast.net Thu Feb 8 10:41:06 2007 From: SqrFolkDnc at comcast.net (Carey Tyler Schug) Date: Thu Feb 8 10:41:33 2007 Subject: [LUNI] I finally got mainframe linux up #$ In-Reply-To: References: <45CAA0C7.4020802@comcast.net> <1170910422.6077.13.camel@stox.dyndns.org> Message-ID: <45CB52A2.1080301@comcast.net> I have offered to possibly present it at NWCLUG, Windy City NASPA (both Rolling meadows) or CAVMEN (Lincolnshire). I will try to remember to make the announcement here if my offer is accepted. I did have mainframe Linux running at the Feb NWCLUG. The Hercules website is http://www.conmicro.cx/hercules/ and there links there to software and how-to's. Open office crashed and I clicked the wrong button on recovery, so I lost my installation notes. I will want to go thought the whole thing again before I present it, hopefully skipping the blind alleys as I do it again. I'm sure its partly my inexperience with Linux, but there were more problems than I had anticipated from the presumed ready-to-go systems. The main glitches were determining the requires pre-req software, especially for 3270 emulation (which isn't needed for mainframe Linux) I *THINK* the "ready-to-go" systems are more oriented towards running under windows, so that may be an option for some. PS: answers and more for those at the February NWCLUG (from published info on web): I could not find MUSIC or the other non-IBM OS asked about. The TSS images have serious problems. There are install tape images for DOS/360 (and TOS/360) but no disk images. There are listed tapes for OS/MFT and OS/MVT including JES3. There is an installed image for OS/MVT with ASP and HASP. It does emulate 2305s and 2311s. It does not emulate 2520 or 2540 card punches or 2400 series tape drives nor the multi function card machine. It does not support 1404 or 3800 printers. It supports CTCs and 3088s, also 3172s and other lan connection devices. It will support mainframe multiprocessors but you must recompile Hercules for more than 2. It supports vector and I saw a reference to supporting crypto, although that is not on the main Hercules page. I would guess the crypto may be for herc to herc use only, i.e. the same programming interface but different encryption than the real hardware. Samir Faci wrote: > You know.. I actually wouldn't mind seeing some how to on that.. or docs. > > and yes.. definitely masochist ...but so is running linux half the > time... (or is that vista.. i forget) > > On 2/7/07, Kenneth P. Stox wrote: >> On Wed, 2007-02-07 at 22:02 -0600, Carey Tyler Schug wrote: >> > I finally got the Hercules emulator working, and under it I have run >> > Mainframe 31 bit Linux, along with the old "free" versions of MVS 3.8 >> > and VM R6. >> >> Masochism at its best! Just add punch cards, and you're all set. ;-> >> >> ABEND >> > From Penguin at waxmoustache.com Thu Feb 8 11:13:31 2007 From: Penguin at waxmoustache.com (James Velguth) Date: Thu Feb 8 11:12:22 2007 Subject: [LUNI] I finally got mainframe linux up #$ In-Reply-To: <45CB48D0.20105@comcast.net> References: <45CAA0C7.4020802@comcast.net> <1170910422.6077.13.camel@stox.dyndns.org> <45CB48D0.20105@comcast.net> Message-ID: <45CB5A3B.3060801@WaxMoustache.com> Looks like somebody is as old as I am.... Carey Tyler Schug wrote: > Actually, I do have a device that could be rewired to read one card at > a time, two passes per card. It was a card programmer from a Wang > programmable calculator, it reads every other column of an 80 column > card, so flip the card over and read the other columns. It had a big > fat cable which was cut off, so it would have to be wired up to a > matrix of parallel input ports. > > You had to have a bit of masochism to be a computer person in the > early days..... > > Kenneth P. Stox wrote: > >> On Wed, 2007-02-07 at 22:02 -0600, Carey Tyler Schug wrote: >> >> >>> I finally got the Hercules emulator working, and under it I have run >>> Mainframe 31 bit Linux, along with the old "free" versions of MVS >>> 3.8 and VM R6. >>> >> >> >> Masochism at its best! Just add punch cards, and you're all set. ;-> >> >> ABEND >> >> >> >> >> > From trev at advanced-reality.com Thu Feb 8 11:49:39 2007 From: trev at advanced-reality.com (Trev Peterson) Date: Thu Feb 8 11:47:53 2007 Subject: [LUNI] VHS to DVD conversion In-Reply-To: <200702081037.45866.skie@dragonsvalley.com> References: <200702081037.45866.skie@dragonsvalley.com> Message-ID: <1170956979.6968.103.camel@aegir.advanced-reality.com> A SUPPORTED tv tuner card and software to record video should be all you need. To get the job done cheap and quick you may want: http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.asp?Item=N82E16815116620 and nvrec (http://nvrec.sourceforge.net/) If you want to leverage the hardware and software to be a DVR as well then you may want: http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.asp?Item=N82E16815116628 (it has dual tuners) and mythtv (http://www.mythtv.org/) You can also look into knoppmyth if you want a boot from CD distro to try it out or quickly get the VHS converted. HTH On Thu, 2007-02-08 at 10:37 -0600, Branko Kotur wrote: > I'd recently found some old home movies that are on VHS and while watching > them, I realized not only that the tapes won't last forever, but the quality > seemed to be degraded from what I remember years ago. So, I've decided to > find a way to convert them to DVD's, preferably using Linux (what else would > I use?). > > I have all the software I need to create the DVD formats once the video is on > my computer. What I don't have is a way to import the video to the computer > from VHS. I'm assuming that I'll need some type of hardware that sits > between the VCR and the computer (it'll need to use either coax or RCA > cables, I think RCA is the easier way to go). > > My question is, does anyone know of what hardware I can use? I have USB 2.0 > and Firewire, so that shouldn't be an issue. I think I've used all of my PCI > slots, so I'd like to avoid that route, plus I'd like to use it on the laptop > if I feel like it. > > Any suggestions? -- Trev Peterson Advanced Reality Email: trev@advanced-reality.com Phone: +1 847 406 9018 From tylerius at gmail.com Thu Feb 8 12:55:31 2007 From: tylerius at gmail.com (Tyler Stoffel) Date: Thu Feb 8 12:55:39 2007 Subject: [LUNI] Hello Message-ID: <5823ed040702081055o68e14b62p267479e69827b55c@mail.gmail.com> Hi, I am a new member to this list. My name is Tyler Stoffel, I am a photojournalist based in Elk Grove Village. I have been using Mandriva 2006 for about a year. I made the switch from WinXP last year because I left my job as a staff photog in NorCal and decided to go freelance. It was the GIMP that convinced me to make the switch, along with a few other pograms. On a daily basis, I was using OpenOffice, Audacity and the GIMP, as well as firefox and Mozilla composer, on both my Mac at work, and my HP laptop. I liked these apps better than Photoshop, Sonar, and MS Office, IE, etc. -- my alternatives -- and decided to swap my whole OS (I have never been much of a Windows user, professionally I have always used Macs, I just own an old HP laptop that I still can't afford to upgrade, and leaving my staff postion meant losing my work Mac, so I needed to find the best alternative to OSX, and for me, last year, Mandriva 2006 was it). I do have a question for the list, I am looking for a multimedia editing app that will allow me to combine jpegs and mp3s into movies. If I were on a Mac, I would use Final Cut. I have a version of Cinelerra, which I like, except that it was developed for 64 bit machines, so on my 32 bit machine, it is unreliable. I also have an older version of Kino which came on my Mandriva distro, it claims it supports jpegs, but if I try to load a couple, I get an unrecognized file type message. Any ideas? Tyler Stoffel -- www.tylerstoffel.com tyler.stoffel@gmail.com 773.827.4468 "The only regret I will have in dying, is if it is not for love." -- Gabriel Garcia Marquez From mark at msbrepairs.com Thu Feb 8 13:30:21 2007 From: mark at msbrepairs.com (Mark Stuart Burge) Date: Thu Feb 8 13:30:02 2007 Subject: [LUNI] Hello In-Reply-To: <5823ed040702081055o68e14b62p267479e69827b55c@mail.gmail.com> References: <5823ed040702081055o68e14b62p267479e69827b55c@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <45CB7A4D.4060407@msbrepairs.com> Broadcast 2000 was kicking around a few years ago, but I think it may have been dropped in favor of cinelerra. If you can find the source for it, that might be worth a try. Tyler Stoffel wrote: > Hi, I am a new member to this list. My name is Tyler Stoffel, I am a > photojournalist based in Elk Grove Village. I have been using Mandriva > 2006 > for about a year. I made the switch from WinXP last year because I > left my > job as a staff photog in NorCal and decided to go freelance. It was > the GIMP > that convinced me to make the switch, along with a few other pograms. > On a > daily basis, I was using OpenOffice, Audacity and the GIMP, as well as > firefox and Mozilla composer, on both my Mac at work, and my HP laptop. I > liked these apps better than Photoshop, Sonar, and MS Office, IE, etc. > -- my > alternatives -- and decided to swap my whole OS (I have never been > much of a > Windows user, professionally I have always used Macs, I just own an > old HP > laptop that I still can't afford to upgrade, and leaving my staff postion > meant losing my work Mac, so I needed to find the best alternative to > OSX, > and for me, last year, Mandriva 2006 was it). > > I do have a question for the list, I am looking for a multimedia > editing app > that will allow me to combine jpegs and mp3s into movies. If I were on a > Mac, I would use Final Cut. I have a version of Cinelerra, which I like, > except that it was developed for 64 bit machines, so on my 32 bit > machine, > it is unreliable. I also have an older version of Kino which came on my > Mandriva distro, it claims it supports jpegs, but if I try to load a > couple, > I get an unrecognized file type message. Any ideas? > > Tyler Stoffel > From tylerius at gmail.com Thu Feb 8 13:42:17 2007 From: tylerius at gmail.com (Tyler Stoffel) Date: Thu Feb 8 13:42:25 2007 Subject: [LUNI] Hello In-Reply-To: <45CB7A4D.4060407@msbrepairs.com> References: <5823ed040702081055o68e14b62p267479e69827b55c@mail.gmail.com> <45CB7A4D.4060407@msbrepairs.com> Message-ID: <5823ed040702081142j116f68fcp756bd0793aad2bb@mail.gmail.com> Thank you, Mark. Tyler On 2/8/07, Mark Stuart Burge wrote: > > Broadcast 2000 was kicking around a few years ago, but I think it may > have been dropped in favor of cinelerra. If you can find the source for > it, that might be worth a try. > > > > Tyler Stoffel wrote: > > Hi, I am a new member to this list. My name is Tyler Stoffel, I am a > > photojournalist based in Elk Grove Village. I have been using Mandriva > > 2006 > > for about a year. I made the switch from WinXP last year because I > > left my > > job as a staff photog in NorCal and decided to go freelance. It was > > the GIMP > > that convinced me to make the switch, along with a few other pograms. > > On a > > daily basis, I was using OpenOffice, Audacity and the GIMP, as well as > > firefox and Mozilla composer, on both my Mac at work, and my HP laptop. > I > > liked these apps better than Photoshop, Sonar, and MS Office, IE, etc. > > -- my > > alternatives -- and decided to swap my whole OS (I have never been > > much of a > > Windows user, professionally I have always used Macs, I just own an > > old HP > > laptop that I still can't afford to upgrade, and leaving my staff > postion > > meant losing my work Mac, so I needed to find the best alternative to > > OSX, > > and for me, last year, Mandriva 2006 was it). > > > > I do have a question for the list, I am looking for a multimedia > > editing app > > that will allow me to combine jpegs and mp3s into movies. If I were on a > > Mac, I would use Final Cut. I have a version of Cinelerra, which I like, > > except that it was developed for 64 bit machines, so on my 32 bit > > machine, > > it is unreliable. I also have an older version of Kino which came on my > > Mandriva distro, it claims it supports jpegs, but if I try to load a > > couple, > > I get an unrecognized file type message. Any ideas? > > > > Tyler Stoffel > > > -- > Linux Users Of Northern Illinois - Technical Discussion > http://luni.org/mailman/listinfo/luni > -- www.tylerstoffel.com tyler.stoffel@gmail.com 773.827.4468 "The only regret I will have in dying, is if it is not for love." -- Gabriel Garcia Marquez From dmourati at cm.math.uiuc.edu Thu Feb 8 13:55:51 2007 From: dmourati at cm.math.uiuc.edu (Demetri Mouratis) Date: Thu Feb 8 13:56:05 2007 Subject: [LUNI] SSH Trickery In-Reply-To: <20070207230454.GK14877@uic.edu> References: <20070207230454.GK14877@uic.edu> Message-ID: On Wed, 7 Feb 2007, John Mason wrote: > On Wed, Feb 07, 2007 at 04:37:01PM -0600, Demetri Mouratis wrote: >> So, my question is this, is there some crafty way I can tell my client, >> openssh 4.3 to do a "double ssh" for hosts in the production network, >> first hopping through ops2, and then going to the production hosts in the >> protected network? I have ssh-agent forwarding enabled so this works if I >> do so manually, e.g.: > > ssh tunnelling. I do this everyday. John, Cool! That works and was close to what I had in mind. Does the fact that I have twenty hosts and growing in this protected network reveal a solution that perhaps scales a bit better? They're all in the same /27 netblock if that helps. (I knew about ssh tunnelling but didn't think of applying it in this case. Glad I threw it out there before wasting any time.) Thanks! From dmourati at cm.math.uiuc.edu Thu Feb 8 14:00:21 2007 From: dmourati at cm.math.uiuc.edu (Demetri Mouratis) Date: Thu Feb 8 14:00:28 2007 Subject: [LUNI] Hello In-Reply-To: <5823ed040702081055o68e14b62p267479e69827b55c@mail.gmail.com> References: <5823ed040702081055o68e14b62p267479e69827b55c@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: Hey Tyler, Welcome to the list. I liked hearing about how you use the Gimp instead of Photoshop. I'm neither a photog nor a imaging processing guy but I have been trying to convince friends who are both that Linux/Gimp can do what they need. They usually scoff and point to missing features in the Gimp. I'm sure you would know if core functionality you needed was missing and would gripe too. -D From ramin-list at badapple.net Thu Feb 8 12:04:06 2007 From: ramin-list at badapple.net (Ramin K) Date: Thu Feb 8 14:04:15 2007 Subject: [LUNI] SSH Trickery In-Reply-To: References: <20070207230454.GK14877@uic.edu> Message-ID: <45CB8236.9050800@badapple.net> Demetri Mouratis wrote: > On Wed, 7 Feb 2007, John Mason wrote: > >> On Wed, Feb 07, 2007 at 04:37:01PM -0600, Demetri Mouratis wrote: >>> So, my question is this, is there some crafty way I can tell my client, >>> openssh 4.3 to do a "double ssh" for hosts in the production network, >>> first hopping through ops2, and then going to the production hosts in >>> the >>> protected network? I have ssh-agent forwarding enabled so this works >>> if I >>> do so manually, e.g.: >> >> ssh tunnelling. I do this everyday. > > John, > > Cool! That works and was close to what I had in mind. Does the fact > that I have twenty hosts and growing in this protected network reveal a > solution that perhaps scales a bit better? They're all in the same /27 > netblock if that helps. > > (I knew about ssh tunnelling but didn't think of applying it in this > case. Glad I threw it out there before wasting any time.) > > Thanks! I'd start thinking about openvpn. IIRC you can also apply security policies on a per users basis though I never bothered since engineers don't have any access to production and no root on staging or development either here. Connect to your openvpn server in the colo which builds a tunnel, injects some routes to your machine so you know what you can get to, and then you'd have free run to all the machines your policy allows. Ramin From skie at dragonsvalley.com Thu Feb 8 14:16:40 2007 From: skie at dragonsvalley.com (Branko Kotur) Date: Thu Feb 8 14:16:52 2007 Subject: [LUNI] VHS to DVD conversion In-Reply-To: <1170956979.6968.103.camel@aegir.advanced-reality.com> References: <200702081037.45866.skie@dragonsvalley.com> <1170956979.6968.103.camel@aegir.advanced-reality.com> Message-ID: <200702081416.40964.skie@dragonsvalley.com> On Thursday 08 February 2007 11:49 am, Trev Peterson wrote: > A SUPPORTED tv tuner card and software to record video should be all you > need. > > To get the job done cheap and quick you may want: > http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.asp?Item=N82E16815116620 > and nvrec (http://nvrec.sourceforge.net/) > > > If you want to leverage the hardware and software to be a DVR as well > then you may want: > http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.asp?Item=N82E16815116628 (it has > dual tuners) > and mythtv (http://www.mythtv.org/) > > You can also look into knoppmyth if you want a boot from CD distro to > try it out or quickly get the VHS converted. > > HTH > I had looked at the Hauppauge cards about a year ago or so, but I think they were a bit more expensive at the time. If there's nothing else that would work, I suppose I can get the one you linked and free up a PCI slot. At one point, I was thinking about making my own dedicated DVR with a Hauppauge card and MythTV, but I never got around to doing it. Thanks for reminding me of these cards. From tylerius at gmail.com Thu Feb 8 14:22:00 2007 From: tylerius at gmail.com (Tyler Stoffel) Date: Thu Feb 8 14:22:04 2007 Subject: [LUNI] Hello In-Reply-To: References: <5823ed040702081055o68e14b62p267479e69827b55c@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <5823ed040702081222p38b594e4r83a420c5f75178b5@mail.gmail.com> There are really two core functions missing from the Gimp, a) batch processing, which I never use anyway, but someone with a hundreds-of-photos-a-day workflow, ie a wedding shooter, would find it very useful; and b) an IPTC editor. IPTC is a text sidecar protocol that allows you to embed a caption into the jpeg. The Gimp has its own version of info embedding, but it is unable to be read by Photoshop, Photo Mechanic, and the other proprietary software used by the papers that buy my photos. But, according to the Gimp's home page, IPTC protocol embedding is in the works. As for now, some clients allow me to send the captions as .doc attachments, or in the body of an email (I email all my work to the buyers) I do have one client that insists on IPTC captions (the Sun Times News Group), so I use my girlfriend's Photoshop on her HP laptop (WinXP) to embed captions for that one client. Tyler Stoffel On 2/8/07, Demetri Mouratis wrote: > > Hey Tyler, > > Welcome to the list. I liked hearing about how you use the Gimp instead > of Photoshop. I'm neither a photog nor a imaging processing guy but I > have been trying to convince friends who are both that Linux/Gimp can do > what they need. They usually scoff and point to missing features in the > Gimp. I'm sure you would know if core functionality you needed was > missing and would gripe too. > > -D > -- > Linux Users Of Northern Illinois - Technical Discussion > http://luni.org/mailman/listinfo/luni > -- www.tylerstoffel.com tyler.stoffel@gmail.com 773.827.4468 "The only regret I will have in dying, is if it is not for love." -- Gabriel Garcia Marquez From kgarner at kgarner.com Thu Feb 8 14:24:26 2007 From: kgarner at kgarner.com (Keith T. Garner) Date: Thu Feb 8 14:24:29 2007 Subject: [LUNI] VHS to DVD conversion In-Reply-To: <1170956979.6968.103.camel@aegir.advanced-reality.com> References: <200702081037.45866.skie@dragonsvalley.com> <1170956979.6968.103.camel@aegir.advanced-reality.com> Message-ID: <45CB86FA.60102@kgarner.com> A little more expensive, but probably will get you a better result is something like the ADVC line from Canopus. (It was just the first example I could find, I haven't used one.) http://canopus.com/products/ADVC110/index.php This is made for exactly what you're doing, and you'll be able to suck the video in via dv, Kino. A friend of mine purchased a similar device and had good results. Keith Trev Peterson wrote: > A SUPPORTED tv tuner card and software to record video should be all you > need. > > To get the job done cheap and quick you may want: > http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.asp?Item=N82E16815116620 > and nvrec (http://nvrec.sourceforge.net/) > > > If you want to leverage the hardware and software to be a DVR as well > then you may want: > http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.asp?Item=N82E16815116628 (it has > dual tuners) > and mythtv (http://www.mythtv.org/) > > You can also look into knoppmyth if you want a boot from CD distro to > try it out or quickly get the VHS converted. > > HTH > > On Thu, 2007-02-08 at 10:37 -0600, Branko Kotur wrote: >> I'd recently found some old home movies that are on VHS and while watching >> them, I realized not only that the tapes won't last forever, but the quality >> seemed to be degraded from what I remember years ago. So, I've decided to >> find a way to convert them to DVD's, preferably using Linux (what else would >> I use?). >> >> I have all the software I need to create the DVD formats once the video is on >> my computer. What I don't have is a way to import the video to the computer >> from VHS. I'm assuming that I'll need some type of hardware that sits >> between the VCR and the computer (it'll need to use either coax or RCA >> cables, I think RCA is the easier way to go). >> >> My question is, does anyone know of what hardware I can use? I have USB 2.0 >> and Firewire, so that shouldn't be an issue. I think I've used all of my PCI >> slots, so I'd like to avoid that route, plus I'd like to use it on the laptop >> if I feel like it. >> >> Any suggestions? -- Keith T. Garner kgarner@kgarner.com "Make no little plans; they have no magic to stir men's blood." - Daniel H. Burnham From jrstark at barntowire.com Thu Feb 8 14:28:10 2007 From: jrstark at barntowire.com (Janine Starykowicz) Date: Thu Feb 8 14:27:57 2007 Subject: [LUNI] VHS to DVD conversion In-Reply-To: <200702081037.45866.skie@dragonsvalley.com> References: <200702081037.45866.skie@dragonsvalley.com> Message-ID: <45CB87DA.8010203@barntowire.com> Branko Kotur wrote: > I'd recently found some old home movies that are on VHS and while watching > them, I realized not only that the tapes won't last forever, but the quality > seemed to be degraded from what I remember years ago. So, I've decided to > find a way to convert them to DVD's, preferably using Linux (what else would > I use?). If you need to add hardware, you might want to look at a standalone DVD/VHS recorder instead. I bought a Lite-On last year for right around $100. It records both, and has one-touch VHS to DVD recording. Janine From dhorton at speakeasy.net Thu Feb 8 20:36:59 2007 From: dhorton at speakeasy.net (David Horton) Date: Thu Feb 8 14:37:06 2007 Subject: [LUNI] Hello Message-ID: Broadcast 2000 was indeed replaced by Cinelerra. Cinelerra has some very powerful features, but I prefer Kino for it's ease of use. Tyler, have checked the latest release of Kino? (www.kinodv.org) They seem to be actively making improvements. Maybe the jpeg problem you experienced has been fixed in the latest version (0.9.5). > -----Original Message----- > From: Mark Stuart Burge [mailto:mark@msbrepairs.com] > Sent: Thursday, February 8, 2007 07:30 PM > To: 'Linux Users Of Northern Illinois - Technical Discussion' > Subject: Re: [LUNI] Hello > > Broadcast 2000 was kicking around a few years ago, but I think it may > have been dropped in favor of cinelerra. If you can find the source for > it, that might be worth a try. > > > > Tyler Stoffel wrote: > > Hi, I am a new member to this list. My name is Tyler Stoffel, I am a > > photojournalist based in Elk Grove Village. I have been using Mandriva > > 2006 > > for about a year. I made the switch from WinXP last year because I > > left my > > job as a staff photog in NorCal and decided to go freelance. It was > > the GIMP > > that convinced me to make the switch, along with a few other pograms. > > On a > > daily basis, I was using OpenOffice, Audacity and the GIMP, as well as > > firefox and Mozilla composer, on both my Mac at work, and my HP laptop. I > > liked these apps better than Photoshop, Sonar, and MS Office, IE, etc. > > -- my > > alternatives -- and decided to swap my whole OS (I have never been > > much of a > > Windows user, professionally I have always used Macs, I just own an > > old HP > > laptop that I still can't afford to upgrade, and leaving my staff postion > > meant losing my work Mac, so I needed to find the best alternative to > > OSX, > > and for me, last year, Mandriva 2006 was it). > > > > I do have a question for the list, I am looking for a multimedia > > editing app > > that will allow me to combine jpegs and mp3s into movies. If I were on a > > Mac, I would use Final Cut. I have a version of Cinelerra, which I like, > > except that it was developed for 64 bit machines, so on my 32 bit > > machine, > > it is unreliable. I also have an older version of Kino which came on my > > Mandriva distro, it claims it supports jpegs, but if I try to load a > > couple, > > I get an unrecognized file type message. Any ideas? > > > > Tyler Stoffel > > > -- > Linux Users Of Northern Illinois - Technical Discussion > http://luni.org/mailman/listinfo/luni > From ohrock at gmail.com Thu Feb 8 14:37:02 2007 From: ohrock at gmail.com (Roberto Serrano) Date: Thu Feb 8 14:43:55 2007 Subject: [LUNI] VHS to DVD conversion In-Reply-To: <200702081416.40964.skie@dragonsvalley.com> References: <200702081037.45866.skie@dragonsvalley.com> <1170956979.6968.103.camel@aegir.advanced-reality.com> <200702081416.40964.skie@dragonsvalley.com> Message-ID: <3d76512f0702081237t10effa0wb515d82aa269c829@mail.gmail.com> I use Hauppauge for my Myth box. The pvr-150 are well supported and they have decent quality. They output Mpeg-2, and if the source is decent, the quality is pretty good. You can find them for around 60 bucks: http://www.amazon.com/Wintv-pvr-150-Mce-Non-fm-Wb/dp/B000E65HOO/sr=8-3/qid=1170966867/ref=pd_bbs_sr_3/002-5870790-5095239?ie=UTF8&s=electronics I've never done an mpeg2 to dvd conversion but there are plenty of tutorials out there. And as for the capture, mplayer can do that for you, if you don't want to deal with any other programs. On 2/8/07, Branko Kotur wrote: > On Thursday 08 February 2007 11:49 am, Trev Peterson wrote: > > A SUPPORTED tv tuner card and software to record video should be all you > > need. > > > > To get the job done cheap and quick you may want: > > http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.asp?Item=N82E16815116620 > > and nvrec (http://nvrec.sourceforge.net/) > > > > > > If you want to leverage the hardware and software to be a DVR as well > > then you may want: > > http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.asp?Item=N82E16815116628 (it has > > dual tuners) > > and mythtv (http://www.mythtv.org/) > > > > You can also look into knoppmyth if you want a boot from CD distro to > > try it out or quickly get the VHS converted. > > > > HTH > > > I had looked at the Hauppauge cards about a year ago or so, but I think they > were a bit more expensive at the time. If there's nothing else that would > work, I suppose I can get the one you linked and free up a PCI slot. > > At one point, I was thinking about making my own dedicated DVR with a > Hauppauge card and MythTV, but I never got around to doing it. > > Thanks for reminding me of these cards. > -- > Linux Users Of Northern Illinois - Technical Discussion > http://luni.org/mailman/listinfo/luni > From dmourati at cm.math.uiuc.edu Thu Feb 8 14:47:27 2007 From: dmourati at cm.math.uiuc.edu (Demetri Mouratis) Date: Thu Feb 8 14:47:35 2007 Subject: [LUNI] SSH Trickery In-Reply-To: <45CB8236.9050800@badapple.net> References: <45CB8236.9050800@badapple.net> Message-ID: On Thu, 8 Feb 2007, Ramin K wrote: > Demetri Mouratis wrote: >> On Wed, 7 Feb 2007, John Mason wrote: >> >>> On Wed, Feb 07, 2007 at 04:37:01PM -0600, Demetri Mouratis wrote: >>>> So, my question is this, is there some crafty way I can tell my client, >>>> openssh 4.3 to do a "double ssh" for hosts in the production network, >>>> first hopping through ops2, and then going to the production hosts in the >>>> protected network? I have ssh-agent forwarding enabled so this works if >>>> I >>>> do so manually, e.g.: >>> >>> ssh tunnelling. I do this everyday. >> >> John, >> >> Cool! That works and was close to what I had in mind. Does the fact that I >> have twenty hosts and growing in this protected network reveal a solution >> that perhaps scales a bit better? They're all in the same /27 netblock if >> that helps. >> >> (I knew about ssh tunnelling but didn't think of applying it in this case. >> Glad I threw it out there before wasting any time.) >> >> Thanks! > > I'd start thinking about openvpn. IIRC you can also apply security policies > on a per users basis though I never bothered since engineers don't have any > access to production and no root on staging or development either here. > > Connect to your openvpn server in the colo which builds a tunnel, injects > some routes to your machine so you know what you can get to, and then you'd > have free run to all the machines your policy allows. > No development root access for engineeers, eh? Must be nice. I tried, unsuccesfully first with Eng, then with QA but got beaten back horribly until I just said fine. Now I just take joy each time they screw something up and can't figure out why. The VPN solution is interesting as well. I think we had that at one point but got rid of it. I'll hit up my boss to see what he says as the network guy around here. Me, I just want to know there aren't too many hands in the cookie jar. Implementation is interesting but not something I feel strongly about one way or the other. Thanks again! -D From skie at dragonsvalley.com Thu Feb 8 14:47:43 2007 From: skie at dragonsvalley.com (Branko Kotur) Date: Thu Feb 8 14:47:51 2007 Subject: [LUNI] VHS to DVD conversion In-Reply-To: <45CB87DA.8010203@barntowire.com> References: <200702081037.45866.skie@dragonsvalley.com> <45CB87DA.8010203@barntowire.com> Message-ID: <200702081447.43633.skie@dragonsvalley.com> On Thursday 08 February 2007 2:28 pm, Janine Starykowicz wrote: > If you need to add hardware, you might want to look at a standalone > DVD/VHS recorder instead. I bought a Lite-On last year for right around > $100. It records both, and has one-touch VHS to DVD recording. > > Janine I was actually hoping to play with the video a bit before creating the DVD, as well as adding my own DVD menu's and having multiple movies on one DVD since not all VHS tapes are fully used. From tylerius at gmail.com Thu Feb 8 14:52:57 2007 From: tylerius at gmail.com (Tyler Stoffel) Date: Thu Feb 8 14:53:01 2007 Subject: [LUNI] Hello In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <5823ed040702081252r309249b7y993081d65e8dc9e7@mail.gmail.com> I looked at it. Here's my problem, and I know it's a dumb one, if it doesn't have an rpm, I don't know how to install it. I used to, but I lost my list of comands, and console stuff is very foreign to me. Starting from having the tarball on my desktop, how would I install Kino? Tyler On 2/8/07, David Horton wrote: > > Broadcast 2000 was indeed replaced by Cinelerra. Cinelerra has some very > powerful features, but I prefer Kino for it's ease of use. Tyler, have > checked the latest release of Kino? (www.kinodv.org) They seem to be > actively making improvements. Maybe the jpeg problem you experienced has > been fixed in the latest version (0.9.5). > > > > -----Original Message----- > > From: Mark Stuart Burge [mailto:mark@msbrepairs.com] > > Sent: Thursday, February 8, 2007 07:30 PM > > To: 'Linux Users Of Northern Illinois - Technical Discussion' > > Subject: Re: [LUNI] Hello > > > > Broadcast 2000 was kicking around a few years ago, but I think it may > > have been dropped in favor of cinelerra. If you can find the source for > > it, that might be worth a try. > > > > > > > > Tyler Stoffel wrote: > > > Hi, I am a new member to this list. My name is Tyler Stoffel, I am a > > > photojournalist based in Elk Grove Village. I have been using Mandriva > > > 2006 > > > for about a year. I made the switch from WinXP last year because I > > > left my > > > job as a staff photog in NorCal and decided to go freelance. It was > > > the GIMP > > > that convinced me to make the switch, along with a few other pograms. > > > On a > > > daily basis, I was using OpenOffice, Audacity and the GIMP, as well as > > > firefox and Mozilla composer, on both my Mac at work, and my HP > laptop. I > > > liked these apps better than Photoshop, Sonar, and MS Office, IE, etc. > > > -- my > > > alternatives -- and decided to swap my whole OS (I have never been > > > much of a > > > Windows user, professionally I have always used Macs, I just own an > > > old HP > > > laptop that I still can't afford to upgrade, and leaving my staff > postion > > > meant losing my work Mac, so I needed to find the best alternative to > > > OSX, > > > and for me, last year, Mandriva 2006 was it). > > > > > > I do have a question for the list, I am looking for a multimedia > > > editing app > > > that will allow me to combine jpegs and mp3s into movies. If I were on > a > > > Mac, I would use Final Cut. I have a version of Cinelerra, which I > like, > > > except that it was developed for 64 bit machines, so on my 32 bit > > > machine, > > > it is unreliable. I also have an older version of Kino which came on > my > > > Mandriva distro, it claims it supports jpegs, but if I try to load a > > > couple, > > > I get an unrecognized file type message. Any ideas? > > > > > > Tyler Stoffel > > > > > -- > > Linux Users Of Northern Illinois - Technical Discussion > > http://luni.org/mailman/listinfo/luni > > > > > -- > Linux Users Of Northern Illinois - Technical Discussion > http://luni.org/mailman/listinfo/luni > -- www.tylerstoffel.com tyler.stoffel@gmail.com 773.827.4468 "The only regret I will have in dying, is if it is not for love." -- Gabriel Garcia Marquez From tylerius at gmail.com Thu Feb 8 14:56:12 2007 From: tylerius at gmail.com (Tyler Stoffel) Date: Thu Feb 8 14:56:16 2007 Subject: [LUNI] Hello In-Reply-To: <5823ed040702081252r309249b7y993081d65e8dc9e7@mail.gmail.com> References: <5823ed040702081252r309249b7y993081d65e8dc9e7@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <5823ed040702081256q78669731ycb00328d54d020a0@mail.gmail.com> Oh, I should add I just urpmi'ed it, but it gave me version 0.7.6, not0.9.5. Tyler On 2/8/07, Tyler Stoffel wrote: > > I looked at it. Here's my problem, and I know it's a dumb one, if it > doesn't have an rpm, I don't know how to install it. I used to, but I lost > my list of comands, and console stuff is very foreign to me. Starting from > having the tarball on my desktop, how would I install Kino? > > Tyler > > On 2/8/07, David Horton wrote: > > > > Broadcast 2000 was indeed replaced by Cinelerra. Cinelerra has some > > very > > powerful features, but I prefer Kino for it's ease of use. Tyler, have > > checked the latest release of Kino? ( www.kinodv.org) They seem to be > > actively making improvements. Maybe the jpeg problem you experienced > > has > > been fixed in the latest version (0.9.5). > > > > > > > -----Original Message----- > > > From: Mark Stuart Burge [mailto: mark@msbrepairs.com] > > > Sent: Thursday, February 8, 2007 07:30 PM > > > To: 'Linux Users Of Northern Illinois - Technical Discussion' > > > Subject: Re: [LUNI] Hello > > > > > > Broadcast 2000 was kicking around a few years ago, but I think it may > > > have been dropped in favor of cinelerra. If you can find the source > > for > > > it, that might be worth a try. > > > > > > > > > > > > Tyler Stoffel wrote: > > > > Hi, I am a new member to this list. My name is Tyler Stoffel, I am a > > > > photojournalist based in Elk Grove Village. I have been using > > Mandriva > > > > 2006 > > > > for about a year. I made the switch from WinXP last year because I > > > > left my > > > > job as a staff photog in NorCal and decided to go freelance. It was > > > > the GIMP > > > > that convinced me to make the switch, along with a few other > > pograms. > > > > On a > > > > daily basis, I was using OpenOffice, Audacity and the GIMP, as well > > as > > > > firefox and Mozilla composer, on both my Mac at work, and my HP > > laptop. I > > > > liked these apps better than Photoshop, Sonar, and MS Office, IE, > > etc. > > > > -- my > > > > alternatives -- and decided to swap my whole OS (I have never been > > > > much of a > > > > Windows user, professionally I have always used Macs, I just own an > > > > old HP > > > > laptop that I still can't afford to upgrade, and leaving my staff > > postion > > > > meant losing my work Mac, so I needed to find the best alternative > > to > > > > OSX, > > > > and for me, last year, Mandriva 2006 was it). > > > > > > > > I do have a question for the list, I am looking for a multimedia > > > > editing app > > > > that will allow me to combine jpegs and mp3s into movies. If I were > > on a > > > > Mac, I would use Final Cut. I have a version of Cinelerra, which I > > like, > > > > except that it was developed for 64 bit machines, so on my 32 bit > > > > machine, > > > > it is unreliable. I also have an older version of Kino which came on > > my > > > > Mandriva distro, it claims it supports jpegs, but if I try to load a > > > > > > couple, > > > > I get an unrecognized file type message. Any ideas? > > > > > > > > Tyler Stoffel > > > > > > > -- > > > Linux Users Of Northern Illinois - Technical Discussion > > > http://luni.org/mailman/listinfo/luni > > > > > > > > > -- > > Linux Users Of Northern Illinois - Technical Discussion > > http://luni.org/mailman/listinfo/luni > > > > > > -- > www.tylerstoffel.com > tyler.stoffel@gmail.com > 773.827.4468 > > "The only regret I will have in dying, is if it is not for love." -- > Gabriel Garcia Marquez > -- www.tylerstoffel.com tyler.stoffel@gmail.com 773.827.4468 "The only regret I will have in dying, is if it is not for love." -- Gabriel Garcia Marquez From john at roirecruiting.com Wed Feb 7 15:23:08 2007 From: john at roirecruiting.com (John Popowski, ROI Recruiting) Date: Thu Feb 8 15:02:48 2007 Subject: [LUNI] Linux Admin and Security Analyst Openings in Lombard, IL Message-ID: <044301c74af5$c8d25920$6900a8c0@D8PSD971> Secureworks is a managed IT Security Services provider with facilities in 3 states. They have just expanded their Chicago data center into a fully redundant data center for their Atlanta HQ. They are looking for one, possibly two, Linux sys admins. Position are mid-level, some flexibility here. Duties include systems administration, applications installs and support, light networking. 20-25 employees at this facility. Heavy security operations focus, implementing an EMC SAN. Positions are perm. No contractors. Base, bonus, benefits, stock options. These are perm. Great, rapidly growing company. Implementing a new EMC SAN. I have 2 positions open. Details at bottom. Feel free to share. Also have 2 security analyst positions available. John Secureworks, was voted by SC Magazine in 2006 as the top IPS services provider. Secureworks merged in September with LURHQ, which had been recently selected as MSSP of the Year by Secure Computing Magazine: http://www.lurhq.com/press_scaward2006.html Both have won several other awards. For inquiries, please contact: John Popowski, CPC President ROI Recruiting john@roirecruiting.com www.roirecruiting.com w 843-278-2410 f 843-278-0710 Unix Administrator Openings The TechOps team is currently looking for a Unix Administrator to join our dynamic team. Primary responsibilities will include maintenance of local and remote Linux systems, management of software installations and updates, and light programming/scripting of administration and operations scripts. Additional responsibilities will include escalation support of field errors and installation problems. Requirements for this position are: * At least 5 years Unix systems administrator background. * Strong in Perl and bash scripting. Competence in other languages, such as Python, PHP, C/C++, or Java is desirable * Demonstrated competence in UNIX security concepts and best practices * SSL/PK infrastructures * Ipchains/iptables * Experience managing large numbers of remote systems ( > 100 ) * Knowledge and understanding of effective trouble ticket tracking system use * Remote troubleshooting * PC hardware knowledge including systems using multiple processors and network interfaces, SCSI subsystems, RAID arrays and tape backup systems * Extensive IP/networking background. Complete familiarity with the IP protocol * Demonstrated competence in administering multiple systems of different Unix flavors. Debian Linux experience is a must, while experience with the following operating systems is a plus: Red Hat, Solaris, FreeBSD, other Linux or BSD variants * Experience with centralized storage platforms, technologies and concepts such as SAN, NAS and Network Appliance systems a plus * Demonstrated competence in administering and developing for the following UNIX applications and services: Apache, MySQL, SSH, sendmail, qmail, pop/imap, DNS * Experience in creating and maintaining Debian packages and deploying them across multiple servers Desired experience: * SQL (especially DB2) * Basic XML * FreeBSD based firewall management * Some understanding of BGP, OSPF, RIP and other higher level routing protocols * Software testing / QA * Knowledge and experience in using source control tools such as CVS for development projects. * Technical writing / documentation -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: John Popowski Bus.vcf Type: text/x-vcard Size: 491 bytes Desc: not available Url : http://luni.org/pipermail/luni/attachments/20070207/8ae028c1/JohnPopowskiBus-0001.vcf From MDiPierro at cti.depaul.edu Wed Feb 7 23:35:26 2007 From: MDiPierro at cti.depaul.edu (DiPierro, Massimo) Date: Thu Feb 8 15:03:12 2007 Subject: [LUNI] RE: [Chicago] ChiPy Meeting Thursday February 7th 7pm References: <3096c19d0702071135q67c82c04ob02f486953b5dfc2@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <6BE417C96732934A83E4BBBB3B7FF2F40478179F@haydn.cti.depaul.edu> I posted the news about tomorrow's meeting on the DePaul web site. Sorry for the delay but I am been busy finishing two python based web applications: http://ww w.metacryption.com uses Turbogears http://un.cti.depaul.edu uses Django (from the point of view of the missions it is like a wiki but a bit more sophisticated. It already stores a